The run to 8th edition

Use this area for all discussions of the "gaming" aspect of 40K/Tau.
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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#11 » Apr 23 2017 08:12

Vector Strike wrote:Also, maybe IA14 will be done in 8th style?

I wouldn't bet on it

A few of you might be wondering how the new edition of Warhammer 40,000 affects Forge World’s Horus Heresy rules and army lists. Well, for the moment, it won’t! You can carry on using the existing Warhammer 40,000 ruleset for your Horus Heresy games.

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jens
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#12 » Apr 24 2017 05:31

I'm also very excited. :D

Any word on the release of the normal FW 40k stuff ?
I hope they have it ready around the same time as GW release theirs :smile:

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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#13 » Apr 24 2017 05:38

jens wrote:I'm also very excited. :D

Any word on the release of the normal FW 40k stuff ?
I hope they have it ready around the same time as GW release theirs :smile:


Can I still use all my models?
Yes. Every Warhammer 40,000 miniature we sell today will be usable in the new edition of Warhammer 40,000. What’s more, they’ll be supported with new rules, which will be available from the get go in handy, low-cost books.

Even Forge World models?
Yes, even all of your Warhammer 40,000 Forge World models


;)

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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#14 » Apr 24 2017 06:22

In case you missed it: all codices, supplements, tactical objective cards and painting guides are now "Last chance to buy" ;)

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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#15 » Apr 24 2017 01:34

Okay so a few highlights from todays Q&A stream:
  • We keep using d6
  • stats aren't capped at 10 anymore
  • AV is gone, we'll get a similar system to AoS where vehicles and MCs get worse the more wounds they lose (totally fine with that! Finally people will stop complaining about our stuff being MCs!)
  • if you bought a codex in the past 8 weeks you can contact the Customer Service with proof and you'll get a voucher for your refund
  • the core rules will have 14(!) FOCs
  • Command Points will be a thing. A simple CAD doesn't generate any.
  • 5 different books at launch
  • keyword system
  • Allies are still a thing but super-best-friend deathstars apprently not anymore (due the keyword system)
  • everything can hurt everything but it becomes a lot harder for weaker weapons to hurt tough units like tanks etc. (no details but i'd imagine having to do a second to-wound roll after the first similar to hitting in SW:A)
  • heavy weapons will do multiple wounds
  • templates are gone! All of them!
  • There will be a lot of new factions in the future and one at launch (d'uh probably Deathguard i say)

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AnonAmbientLight
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#16 » Apr 24 2017 04:08

The reddit page has more information too.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/c ... _qa_notes/

What we know so far:

Rules are written in Scottish

New faction coming out with 8th, some with the release

Getting rid of AV for vehicles

Vehicles and MCs will get less potent as they take wounds (lower WS/BS, etc)

"Everything will be able to hurt everyone." Specific example of a lasgun taking out a tank

Heavy weapons will do more wounds than regular weapons (see SW:Armagedon for an idea)

Stat lines no longer capped at 10

Stat lines will have to work much harder now as there's more going on

Unified stat line for all models

Movement values returning

Armor modifiers returning for weapons

Templates are removed, no note on how they change but likely going to multiwound weapons.

If you charge you get to attack first

Big focus on making CC better

Big focus on making the game more accessible: Cheaper, easier rules, etc.

1500 pt games designed to take 90 minutes

3 ways to play: Open, Narrative, Matched
Narrative play will use "Power levels" for each unit. Balance a game around the power levels
Matched play will have a point system very similar to the current game

Open play is basically do what you want

Warhammer 40k app like AoS app

Main rules will be like generals handbook for AoS, updated annually with community feedback

Top 3 design choice: Game that worked for all 3 ways to play (story, narrative, competitive). Make the game more accessible: cheaper, rules, painting, gaming, etc. Get back to Imperial vs Chaos; Make Chaos great again!
Hopefully more balanced than previous editions. Tons of playtesting went into this new edition.

Command Points:
1) Designed to make thematic armies better
2) Armies must be battle forged w/ force org chart
3) Multiple force org charts; 14 at launch. Harder to fill charts give more points
4) Give rerolls, can interrupt charges, etc
5) Gone when used
6) Can only use 1 per phase
7) Designed to modify tactical situations
8) Basic ones in main rulebook with faction specific ones in codexes

All new rules will be out day 1 with 5 new books: Main rules, Xenos, Imperial Chaos, one other
New codexes will have fluff and art as well as rules to make your faction a little more specific (Chapter tactics, command point uses, force org charts)

Should be less expensive than current codexes. Main rules and unit rules will be free with future units getting warscroll style releases between updates.

Major story progression over the next few years but not going to remove what's come before. IE not AoSing the setting

If you feel you recently bought a rulebook and feel you got ripped off they're extending their return policy to 8 weeks from the announcement (last Saturday). If you have proof of purchase they'll give you a voucher for the value if you contact their CS.


Other things to note in the reddit thread that Riptides are being changed or have been play tested extensively. Expect them to be changed in some way. Exciting times.

Edit: Apparently there were some more tidbits of information as well

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/c ... te_foleys/

Saw on twitter that Pete has been clarifying some things/adding some extra info, here's the brief rundown (with links to source).
Fixed "to Hit" Rolls.
Random turn initiative is not ccming to 40k from AoS
You can definitely kill rhinos with lasguns, 50 may—or may not—be enough
Core rules are around a dozen pages!
The video of the stream will go up on Youtube on wednesday.
Last edited by AnonAmbientLight on Apr 24 2017 04:48, edited 1 time in total.
Sky IS Falling, T'au WILL Suck, Sell Me Your Models

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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#17 » Apr 24 2017 04:19

The Riptide thing was only them naming it as example of why they are going to change point costs of units so there aren't any obviously broken units anymore. So something that was quite obvious. ;)

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Bloodknife92
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#18 » Apr 24 2017 05:09

All these updates are super exciting! I'm interested to see where they go with template weapons and Monstruous Creatures. I really hope that Riptides and Crisis get to move faster than Fire Warriors. A single footstep from a riptide would be half the Fire Warriors' movement :P

The power levels system also looks interesting!
The days of goodly English is went

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TauMan
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#19 » Apr 24 2017 07:17

Sorry gents for getting late in on the discussion, Real LifeTM had a hold of me.

El'mo said:
And with my Mod hat on please remember the first rule on this forum...
1) Treat each other with respect whilst using family-appropriate language.

The Admin team may warn, delete, or ban users whose posts consistently fail to meet the criteria explained in our Membership Primers, which all members of ATT are expected to have read and understood before posting.

Czar Ziggy said:
The other thing to say and get out of the way as well is please no wish-listing for the new edition. This thread should be about discussing the coming changes that Games Workshop have put in stone. It's not productive when people start saying; "Maybe now Fire Warriors will get those heavy weapons finally!"

Carry on.


What's up Mods? Getting me kind of worried writing stuff like that? Do we need protection?
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It seem "most" members are showing some excitement, which might be a little premature...
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But then again some us might need a little reassurance at such a radical change?
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After all 8th edition, blows up everything we understood to be Warhammer 40,0000.
Image



And so it begins...
With the Fall of Warhammer Fantasy, and with the installation of the Vichy Regime a.k.a. Age of Sigmar; Games Workshop shifts it gaze across the Damocles Gulf to Warhammer 40,000. Launching 8th edition across the vastness of the Warp, they rain down vast destruction upon the unexpected fandom of WH40K.


Image


Will this be any good, I don't know?
It's Games Workshop.

I expect a typical "bell curve" result: incredible, 'knock-it-out-of-the-ballpark" rules, with a lot of mediocre stuff in the middle; and on the other end really, really bad rules. And when I mean "bad", I mean the typical Games Workshop ill conceived, half-thought out and confusing rules. And when has it ever be any different? From Rouge Trader to 7th edition, it's generally been the same. Yes, over the years things have gotten better in some respects; but always with same overall lack of consistency and focus. Sometimes it really hits the skids. Who can forget the atrocity that was 4th edition, when the rule book itself was such a travesty that you had to tab the pages just to keep track of what was going on? Since rules, hobby stuff, and fluff were all mixed higgly-piggly altogether! With the rules for the original "Kill Team" stuck stuck right in the middle(???)

Anyone could make a list of their favorite GW atrocities, for whatever edition you want to name; but I leave everyone to groan to themselves on this one. However I'd just like to mention two very recent events: Kill Team (New) and Shadow War: Armageddon.

The first one is just a watered down small point 7th edition game, and the other a mishmash of 3rd and 7th edition with (for no other reason than it is a GW product) the words "Kill Teams" stuck to it?

Uh, what? Isn't there already another game with "Kill Teams" or "Kill Team" in it's title?

Of course GW knew that 8th edition was coming out, so anything based on 3rd or 7th edition was going to be obsolete.

Why was was this, I don't know?
Because it's Games Workshop?

And to those willing to keep up the fight...
We can't change or challenge what's coming; but to help you keep your chin up during the "grim darkness of the near future", here is Winston Churchill's We Shall Never Surrender speech.


Image
Tally-ho chaps! Tally-ho!


The TauMan
And to keep in the spirit of Britain 1940, here's a selection of Vera Lynn songs:
We’ll Meet Again
The White Cliffs of Dover
When I Grow Too Old To Dream
Last edited by TauMan on Apr 24 2017 08:43, edited 2 times in total.
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N.Y.A.B.X.T.T.

Jacket
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#20 » Apr 24 2017 07:54

Sounds like Tau nerf edition inbound. I heard the frontline guys and some other sites testing the rules for 8th and offering balance feedback. More than any other faction they nerfed Tau despite the fact that for the longest time until this year Tau were not even placing in the top 15. I always hear them complaining about the Taunar being so OP and needing to be nerfed and saying the fact that Tau is only viable with it says a lot.

What does that mean Reecie? What do you want the Tau players to use in the ITC exactly? All the overnerfed stuff you toned down on them? Can you blame them when its the only option left?

I'm definitely worried with them having say in the rules. Thankfully other major tournament organizers are also providing feedback and Frankie likes the Tau.

I'm okay with Tau nerfs if they are done with balance in mind to every other faction and not over-nerfed like so many video game companies do when the mobs come. That is not my problem and why I'm making this post. If we don't see all the other even more powerful stuff than anything the Tau has nerfed alongside them fairly then we know there is probably a bias issue.

Edit
I'll try and remain hopeful mods.

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Vector Strike
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#21 » Apr 24 2017 08:55

Jacket wrote:Sounds like Tau nerf edition inbound. I heard the frontline guys and some other sites testing the rules for 8th and offering balance feedback. More than any other faction they nerfed Tau despite the fact that for the longest time until this year Tau were not even placing in the top 15. I always hear them complaining about the Taunar being so OP and needing to be nerfed and saying the fact that Tau is only viable with it says a lot.

What does that mean Reecie? What do you want the Tau players to use in the ITC exactly? All the overnerfed stuff you toned down on them? Can you blame them when its the only option left?

I'm definitely worried with them having say in the rules. Thankfully other major tournament organizers are also providing feedback and Frankie likes the Tau.

I'm okay with Tau nerfs if they are done with balance in mind to every other faction and not over-nerfed like so many video game companies do when the mobs come. That is not my problem and why I'm making this post. If we don't see all the other even more powerful stuff than anything the Tau has nerfed alongside them fairly then we know there is probably a bias issue.

Edit
I'll try and remain hopeful mods.


I agree, ITC organizers have problems with Tau. I fear what they may have done with the army.

Of course, some stuff needed to be toned down (Riptide, Tau'nar), but let's hope it wasn't too much.
On the other hand, GW said this will be the most balanced edition of all. Mayhaps we can use Vespids as a serious threat in the battlefield?

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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#22 » Apr 24 2017 10:45

A Tau nerf isn't necessarily bad if the other big ones get nerfed as well and the weak ones buffed so we meet in the middle though. It all depends on what exactly and how much gets nerfed.

GW also said they were doing a lot of playtesting with the new edition (gathing feedback several sundays for ~10h each) so I have high hopes for the balance to end up in a good spot with the initial release.

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El'mo
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#23 » Apr 25 2017 12:39

TauMan wrote:Sorry gents for getting late in on the discussion, Real LifeTM had a hold of me.

El'mo said:
And with my Mod hat on please remember the first rule on this forum...
1) Treat each other with respect whilst using family-appropriate language.

The Admin team may warn, delete, or ban users whose posts consistently fail to meet the criteria explained in our Membership Primers, which all members of ATT are expected to have read and understood before posting.

Czar Ziggy said:
The other thing to say and get out of the way as well is please no wish-listing for the new edition. This thread should be about discussing the coming changes that Games Workshop have put in stone. It's not productive when people start saying; "Maybe now Fire Warriors will get those heavy weapons finally!"

Carry on.


What's up Mods? Getting me kind of worried writing stuff like that? Do we need protection?


The point of these comments are to remind members of the rules of the board before anything is posted that may cause one of the moderation team to have to step in.

Believe it or not we are not trying to stifle the excitement or discussion on the new rules but we have seen things devolve on other sites and FB into rants and personal insults which go against the ethos of ATT.

All discussion from either viewpoint of 8th... it will be a complete disaster/the best thing since sliced bread or any position in-between is accepted as long as it is within the board rules.

Forewarned is forearmed... :fear:


AnonAmbientLight wrote:What we know so far:
Rules are written in Scottish

I would have expected a multi-lingual version ;)

Blade Runner
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#24 » Apr 25 2017 09:13

I am excited for 8th edition. I have been a long time modeller of GW, probably 17 years off and on, but never decided to play until this year. I did have and still some what do, having only been playing for 8 months a bit of a learning curve when it comes to the rules. So a clean up of the rules is exciting to me, also a 1500pt game being 90minutes, yes please (I have a baby so time to play is difficult to find).

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QimRas
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#25 » Apr 25 2017 01:08

Looks like Games Workshop has posted more information regarding unit profiles.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/201 ... -profiles/

The WS and BS changes in particular jump out at me. Looks like they have changes to static rolls instead of opposed, similar to how Armor Saves were. Kroot may end up more effective as melee fighters.

Also, I wonder how the changes to BS will change Markerlights.

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TauMan
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#26 » Apr 25 2017 01:27

El'mo wrote:The point of these comments are to remind members of the rules of the board before anything is posted that may cause one of the moderation team to have to step in.

Believe it or not we are not trying to stifle the excitement or discussion on the new rules but we have seen things devolve on other sites and FB into rants and personal insults which go against the ethos of ATT.

All discussion from either viewpoint of 8th... it will be a complete disaster/the best thing since sliced bread or any position in-between is accepted as long as it is within the board rules.

Forewarned is forearmed... :fear:


El'mo I gathered as such, and that was why I chose the "air raid warden" metaphor. And thanks to you and all the Mods for keeping the discussion so far civil and respectful. And to every member of A.T.T. as well, who has posted so far.
Image
Good job there lads!


The TauMan
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Last edited by TauMan on Apr 25 2017 01:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Panzer
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#27 » Apr 25 2017 01:37

There we go! The first unit profiles!
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/25/warhammer-40000-unit-profiles/

  • Fix to-hit roll for both melee and ranged. Well the ranged one was always kinda fixed and the melee one was always 3+ or 4+ anyway so no big change here.
  • No Initiative stat anymore!
  • Marines have Movement 6 (Terminator has 5)
  • Dreadnought has T7, 8 wounds and a 3+ armor
  • Tactical Marines only have LD7 (keep in mind that we're getting the AoS Battleshock system unfortunately...)
  • Terminators with 2 wounds!

Tomorrow they'll give us weapon leaks!

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TauMan
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Re: The run to 8th edition

Post#28 » Apr 25 2017 01:48

Panzer wrote:There we go! The first unit profiles!


Oops QimRas just posted this! :roll:

Well, thanks anyways Panzer. With info about 8th edition coming so fast, members posting the same items was bound to happen.

TauMan
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