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Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 16 2016 05:37
by Spartan088
what quality plastic did you get. I am looking to get the shoulder mounts as White Strong & Flexible Polished. I am worried the quality and look wont match the stormsurge (cant afford the more expensive ones)

I am definitly doing the covers at the highest quality.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 17 2016 02:48
by Kael'yn
I hoped to be clear here and on Shapeways about materials and models in prototype stage:

WSF polished is more "smooth" than WSF (smooth as a 400 sanding paper is) but not as smooth as plastic (only very high quality prints like those used to create casting masters can achieve that and price is prohibitive).
To have a smooth feel in WSF polished, you need to coat the model with resin (or a thick paint or varnish layer, maybe multiple layers if needed to fill the irregularities) then sand it. Liquid GS or Vallejo liquid mastic may works too but I didn't test them (I will post a tutorial if I have time for it).
FUD and FXD are the closest way to achieve the smooth feel (even if they are not totally smooth), but the price is higher (at the moment). Once the shapes will fit the cockpit at 100% (latest prototype is inbound), I will release the weakened but hollowed model (which will be around $9 in FUD, cheaper if taken bundled).



For the prototype, I used a nearby printing services via 3DHubs in a Form1+ SLA grey resin printer in 0.025 mm / 25 µm (some services propose cheaper prices than Shapeways, other not and quality/service may vary). You need the STL file to upload there (PM me to have access to my latest prototype so far). Details are good and surface quality is equivalent or better than FUD (not totally plastic-smooth but looking quite fine). The service I used have reasonable prices but is located in France....

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 18 2016 12:46
by Agentarrow
Does Form1 resin cut or sand like regular cast resin, or else similarly? My biggest issue with FUD/FXD is that it is incredibly hard and brittle, which makes cutting and sanding it more difficult than WSF.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 18 2016 04:51
by Kael'yn
Form 1 resin (grey hard version) could be worked like any hard cast resin and is a little more forgiving that FXD, but not as much as Forgeworld resin for example (which is a little more elastic).
I had no difficulties to cut and file the Form prototypes to see the shape matching (but some parts breaks eventually due to parts thinness).

I had not the same parts in FUD/FXD thinkness to compare but looking roughly at material datasheets (Form, Frosted, WSF) and my experiences they behave almost similarly (Form is a little harder but allow a little more stress without breaking).

WSF is for me harder so sand it properly because of the "aggregated" structure which made it hard to smooth enough without fixing the Nylon sintered powder with varnish/resin/paint.

TL:DR
I would say: give Form a try. It have its advantages over FXD on surface aspect and resilience, but have problems when it come to small and thin parts (Frosted allow 0.3mm thick walls and 0.1 mm details that Form had difficulties to achieve). For large flat parts that bear weight, I would say Form is better, but for very small parts, Frosted is better.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 19 2016 10:53
by nova_wolf
The other day, I ordered a set of the Missile Pod fitting arms and two sets of the cockpit over (my mate wanted one too) whilst Shapeways have their free global shipping deal on.

Already been posted out after just 3 days!!!

Cannot wait to get them as I have a brand new Stormsurge sat in box waiting - these parts are the only reason I bought a SS as I can't stand the way it looks as stock.

I just need to figure out where I will be mounting the twin-linked weapon mount and Seeker Missiles as I will be removing them from the "missile mittens" as I have dubbed them.

Should have photos mid Sept as the parts are going to take a week or 2 to get to Ol' Blightly... An agonizing wait it will be...

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 19 2016 12:44
by Kael'yn
Thanks for your order and faith in prototypes (cockpit cover). SW is slower for me usually (at least two weeks often: I ordered some FUD yesterday and delivery is due to Sept. 5th ...)

You can maybe use the left shoulder missile supports for the seekers: use the missile half ball joint from the "mitten", glue it under the seeker assembled to have a 2x2 seeker array and put them on the left missile shoulder support (the right is obvioulsy not used to made way to the main gun).
look at this quick assembly if you don't know what I mean:
Image
(if you want only the left shoulder missile support, ask me and I will put it on Shapeways or send the STL for you to print yourself, price will be around $10 in FUD probably for this only part.)

For the turret, I plan myself to fit each weapon of the twin turret under each missile array. But the upper side of the twin seeker array can be used too.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 19 2016 02:03
by shasocastris
As much I've become used to and even fond of the current stormsurge model, I really dig this and I can't way to see a full model.

And I will be getting some cockpit covers soon. Those seem pretty cool. (And an excuse to paint less things!)

Cheers!

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 23 2016 05:08
by nova_wolf
Kael'yn wrote:You can maybe use the left shoulder missile supports for the seekers: use the missile half ball joint from the "mitten", glue it under the seeker assembled to have a 2x2 seeker array and put them on the left missile shoulder support (the right is obvioulsy not used to made way to the main gun).
look at this quick assembly if you don't know what I mean:
Image
(if you want only the left shoulder missile support, ask me and I will put it on Shapeways or send the STL for you to print yourself, price will be around $10 in FUD probably for this only part.)


That's a genius idea, and would love to do that but I am all outta funds right now.

But I would very much like to order one next month once payday has rolled around if you can make just the left shoulder mount available on your Shapeways as I'd rather support you in your endeavours than try and bodge something up.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 25 2016 04:03
by Khanaris
I received the cover plate from Shapeways and I can confirm that it does not fit in the opening. The side-to-side measurement looks perfect and the circles are well-aligned with the cutouts, but as you noted the piece is slightly too long front-to-back. I would suggest pulling that one down from Shapeways until you are ready to put up the next version. I agree that it could be made to fit by shaving material off on either the resin or the plastic, but there is not much room on the back side of the plastic and the front side can't be trimmed. The resin part has the cutouts for the doors, so I am not sure it would still look right if you shaved the required amount off of the back.

I can post pictures if that would help, but it is basically the same thing as the pictures already posted except that the Shapeways resin appears stiffer.

Anyway, eagerly awaiting the next iteration. The detail on these was fantastic. The doors actually fit better than they appear to in the non-Shapeways images. When they are in and closed you can not really even tell that they are separate pieces.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 25 2016 04:40
by nova_wolf
Image

Ta da :-)

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 25 2016 05:14
by Kael'yn
@khanaris
Thanks for the feedback. I am at version 3 (even more corrected than Shapeways version 2, with some minor tweaks), received and tested today. I don't have taken pics as I am testing other parts and build them on the model first, but the frame fitting is now close to the model. Still need a little sanding to fit well and minimize the gaps but even with only gap-filling the model seems fine.

Missile supports are tested too and their fitting is to be reviewed too (they are more easier to fit on the model, but not perfect). It seems that the missile holder may benefit to be 5mm higher, as it is a little too short in height.

I will adjust then the model, post pics and update the Shapeways item.

The hatches on the pictures I took were misplaced because I didn't glued them in place. I didn't commented on that because as the hatches were integrated in my 3D concept, their fitting is supposed to be accurate. I will make also a little upgrade with a support for the pilot hatch as it is tedious to assemble closed compared to the gunner hatch.

@nova_wolf
Thanks for your pic. The sensor use is great.

And for people wanting pics of a full model (mine is not finished nor painted at the moment) just a digital preview of the current model alongside other possibilities:
Image

EDIT: here pics of models fit on the torso (with minimal sanding). Sorry for blurry pics, the white primer mess with the autofocus.
Image

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 27 2016 03:02
by Tarnag
That looks fantastic! Can't wait for the little adjustments so I can order my own! Those 3D models are helpful as well, I feel like this is what the Stormsurge should've been upon release. I'm very excited to be rocking two of them soon.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 31 2016 12:17
by Kael'yn
Thanks.

I had little free time now and for the next weeks, but I have infos to share before doing a bigger update.

First, the cockpit cover on Shapeways is now the same model than mine, with some minor corrections based on my own model building. The only updates I may add now to the models will be based on user inputs to ease the fitting on more Stormsurge models. I may release a hollowed version, for a few 20% saving only (around $10 vs $12 for the current model). You may save more by buying items in bulks or combined with other parts.

Then, I put the missile support in thin version on Shapeways. Like I said in the previous post, I may update the model later with an ability to choose the height of the missile arrays cups (to rise them by 2 to 5 mm).

Also I received the thinner version of the arms. And they hold very well a moderate stress.
I am able to press the two opposite edges of the gauntlets without deformations and breaking even if the model walls are 0.4mm thick. So I consider the model sturdy enough to hold well the load of a standard gaming stress. I may add some inner reinforcements to be sure but the models are amazingly sturdy for their thickness.
Shoulders are even more resilient (they have smaller surfaces). Maybe the elbow is a little too thin, but their roundness still help to hold well the stress.
Models would not sustain easily high falls if they protrude, but for a big model like the Stormsurge, falls are less likely and if parts broke, their size make the repairs more easy.
I will put slowly the thin models for sale after the next update (with pics of models and stress tests), later this month.

Currently, the savings in FUD are between 40% (missile supports : $17 -> $10 ) to 50% (shoulder + gauntlets with arms: $63 -> $30)

Consequently I will put on side the casting process of the arms (too tedious for me to do with prices near or a little under those of Shapeways FUD thin versions) and release all the parts in thin versions. Casting parts is still a possibility, but not for now for me on my own.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Aug 31 2016 07:38
by Tael
Gorgeous result, and really interesting that 3D printing is near or slightly under the cost to cast.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Sep 13 2016 09:58
by Khanaris
Just got the updated cover plate from Shapeways. Can confirm that this version fits perfectly. Finally we have an answer to rain!

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Sep 13 2016 01:03
by Kael'yn
@Tael:
Thanks
Close-to-cast price are achieved by printing only the outer shell with an extreme thinness. The models are, of course, not as sturdy as a cast model could be.

@Khanaris:
Glad to see you keep faith in my work and removed towels from the Stormsurge crew wargear (unless they plan to travel the Galaxy).


Some infos (more by the end of September I hope):

I ran some test on the thin versions: they are surprisingly sturdy for their thinness. I test glued an arm in place with the long gun underneath, and pushed the tip down. Super glue broke before the models, even if the elbow was a little distorted under the constraint (around 1N or 100g force on the gun tip, roughly the force you need to put a pin in a wall).

Surface is strangely corrugated, but I suspected this came from the machine orientation they choose for printing. A good sanding and everything is better.
Also, I recommend to clean the remaining wax carefully from the model, because the thin version seems more waxy than the thick: a bath in a 50-60 °C water (beware to not let the temperature be over 60°C else the Frosted resin will soften and bend), dishwashing liquid and a toothbrush are good.

I posted a test model on Shapeways to compare prices: http://shpws.me/MESs
You can see the savings by swapping SIZE (over the item price) from Extra-small (=thin version) to Medium (thick version)
This item, and other prototypes could be ordered, see my shop inventory. Until I clean this topic and my shop and maybe review a little the models, thin versions and combo will be put on demand (PM me) on Shapeways.

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Sep 24 2016 05:21
by Kael'yn
Other quick tests run on thin versions today, with proper gluing this time and pics:
Image
The bottle that push over the arm is a 1.5 L sugar cola of a well known brand (around 1,7 kg).
Notice the small deformation on the ball joint, but after removing the load, it get its normal shape.
You cannot believe the models have wall that are only 0.5 mm thick...

These tests convinces me to push all the model to the Thin version by default. Thick versions will still be available, but on demand only.

Cleaning the OP and my shop with properly sorted items and descriptions will be made the next month.
Now that this model seems fine, I may start other projets, Tau related, if life let me some free time.

Thanks to all people that ordered the models. I am eager to see more of your Stormsurges...

Re: 3D print extra parts: Stormsurge, Riptide, Piranha, ...

Posted: Sep 25 2016 03:06
by Tael
Impressive stress testing! Look forward to the new builds too :)