[ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

A review of past Tactics by commanders during the First, Second, Third & Fourth Phase Expansion.
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[ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#1 » Jan 09 2008 12:31

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The Veil of Neutrons

By Revrandom


The Veil of Neutrons is something I came up with to counter a specific tactic used by my regular opponent who plays necrons. Lately he has been using a lord with a veil of darkness and a nightmare shroud which joins a 9 man Immortal squad. They usually deep strike in near my troops and hope to force me to fail leadership checks. Those that don't flee usually get shot by the immortals. To counter this, I've started using the "Veil of Neutrons."

The Veil of Neutrons is a Kauyon/Mont'Ka combo of Vespid and one or more sniper drone teams. The reason it works is simple...the Vespids and snipers are usually far enough away from the VOD point of impact to avoid leadership checks, but close enough to be in threat range to respond.

This is the play by play of how it usually works...

Lord and Immortals VOD in to near the greatest concentration of suits and firewarriors (Kauyon). I don't have Shadowsun, so about half of my units break and run. The Immortals then shoot whatever didn't break. Anything that survives is a bonus shooter for the Veil of Neutrons.

On my turn, the Vespid zoom in 12" which hopefully puts them in range for both shooting and assault. The sniper teams ML the lord unit and open fire with the rifles to hopefully "soften 'um up." After that, the Vespid open up. Hopefully, at this point, the Necron unit will be at pretty low strength when the Vespid assault.

With any luck, a bunch of ML supported AP3 shots followed by an I5 assault will wipe out the unit denying WBB rolls to the Immortals and hopefully causing the lord to miss his. Even if the lord survives, he's down to one wound and usually VODs back to the safety of his own lines allowing me to (hopefully) rally any running units.

Although specifically designed for Anti-VOD necrons, I think the "Veil of Neutrons" could be adapted well to any fast moving AP3 assaulters.




The Bug Screen

By Israfel


My idea for the Vespid can be seen in my Piranha tactica. For those that have not seen it, it is called "The Bug Screen" and goes something like this:

First move the Vespid into the middle of the field behind some size 2 or larger terrain or better yet 6" or greater into some area terrain just so long as they are in a forward position and out of LOS.

This should draw the enemy toward them or typically the opponent will move forward anyway, either way the goal is to put the Vespid in the path of an approaching enemy unit.

Meanwhile a team of 2 Piranha, or 2 individual Piranha need to be at least within 24" of the front of the piece of terrain the Vespid are hiding in/behind. Then on the turn the approaching enemy unit comes within 12" of the front of the said piece of terrain, the Vespid move to the front of said terrain and shoot the approaching unit. In the same movement round the Piranha boost to place themselves in between the terrain the Vespid are hiding in and the approaching unit. This will block assault the following round while the cover they are in will hopefully keep the Vespid scoring.

Some notes about the Piranhas positioning/role

There are pros and cons to keeping the Piranha within 12". Obvious benefits are their ability to shoot with their 4 drones and FB/BC. Another benefit is that if the Vespid fail to deliver adequate damage to the approaching enemy unit then the drones can assault and try to tie the unit up to keep them from shooting the following round.

The con of this is that it becomes less of a surprise to the opponent and traps become less likely. If the Piranha are 24" away the enemy will never see this tactic coming. Additionally, by keeping the Piranha so far away your opponent may split his forces thinking the Piranha are coming at him from a flank or whatnot. So judge your opponents perception level/tactical of ability before deciding on a course of action.

Either way the goal is to place the much more survivable Piranha in the line of fire while the more offensively dangerous (to MEQ at least) Vespid are either ignored or at least able to remain scoring/escape the following round.

Now obviously it is very beneficial to take out as many heavy/special weapon teams that could harm the Piranha before employing this tactic. But another way to assist in their survival during such a maneuver is to spring forward with your other vehicles at the same time thus overloading the opponent with targets and making him make difficult decisions.

If the Piranha survive depending on how damaged/shaken they are you can run them away to preserve VP's or if they are ok then this tactic has the added benefit of moving them into a forward position and likely in a position to strike enemy AV/HQ's/MC's/TEQ.

A variation of this can be accomplished with Kroot who occupy the back end of the terrain the Vespid are hiding in. In this version the Vespid must hide behind the terrain the Kroot are in. It is the Kroot who will then move forward to the front with the Vespid jumping into terrain just behind them to deliver their shots. hen the Kroot can charge whatever remnants of the enemy squad thus creating a sight blocking CC that will also screen the Vespid from CC and shooting.

This version is harder to pull of because of difficutl terrain checks for the Kroot coupled with the short range of the Neutron Blasters. However this tactics becomes mouch more viable in forests where Kroot will always get their 6" move and this version is much more likely to completely protect the Vespid from retaliation.

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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#2 » May 09 2008 02:02

Hmm... I like the way this tatic runs, it does not require a major points sink, is easily scaleable, and a major distraction to your opponents thinking, while being easy to excute,

Overall a great use of fast attack forces that fits into the overall Tau battle plan, while maintaining a positive degree of firepower.

The Vespids are interesting, and useful, but normally thier uses escape me, thank you for posting this idea.

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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#3 » May 15 2008 01:11

You said immortals...arent those the necron terminator Eq? Do you mean warriors? I haven't faced them in a while so i could be wrong.

Otherwise, this sounds like a great strategy. Vespids' high initiative pitted against necron's lack of power weapons makes this all the more useful.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#4 » May 15 2008 02:20

Necrons don't have any 2+ saves. They're pretty much all MEq. Immortals have toughness 5, but that's about what makes them harder to kill.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#5 » Jun 07 2008 03:14

Their weapons are also Assault 2, versus the normal rapid fire of Warriors. Because of this, they are usually a little bit more effective to Veil with, if more expensive.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#6 » Jul 19 2008 06:10

Very interesting tactic with that Vespids and Sniper Team. My friend has just started Necrons but in a game we played using proxies, the Immortals were disgustingly good. They took a lot to put down with conventional firepower so this could be a good tactic to use.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#7 » Jul 19 2008 08:23

Can Vespid deep-strike now in 5th edition? I'm fairly certain that units with jump packs or jet packs can, and since Vespid are jump infantry I thought it might be possible, but I'm pretty sure that they don't technically have jump packs. Sorry, I don't yet have a new rulebook to peruse at my leisure.

The reason I ask is (if they could deepstrike) with a positional relay, you could counter deep-strike the Vespid which would make it easier to ensure that you could get your bugs in range to do their thing. It would also save them from getting shot to pieces before you could use them --thought you couldn't assault afterward.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#8 » Jul 19 2008 08:40

Im pretty certain you cannot deepstrike them as there is no deepstrike special rule for them in the Tau 'dex.

It would be nice but alas I don't think we can!
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#9 » Jul 19 2008 09:19

gr1m_dan wrote:I'm pretty certain you cannot deepstrike them as there is no deepstrike special rule for them in the Tau 'dex.

It would be nice but alas I don't think we can!


In 5th they can. All Jump infantry have Deep strike as a blanket rule now :)
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#10 » Nov 15 2008 03:12

I am afraid that my favorite Vespid tactic is now useless. I'm talking about the bug screen. Since skimmers now block LoS and skimmer squads count as units who provide cover, if you use this your target will get a 4+ cover save, negating the sole strong point of the Vespids, namely the AP3. Am I missing something ? I hope I am missing something.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#11 » Nov 15 2008 11:20

Soji wrote:I am afraid that my favorite Vespid tactic is now useless. I'm talking about the bug screen. Since skimmers now block LoS and skimmer squads count as units who provide cover, if you use this your target will get a 4+ cover save, negating the sole strong point of the Vespids, namely the AP3. Am I missing something ? I hope I am missing something.



Perhaps you can use crisis suits to screen your bugs by jumping ahead of them in the assault phase? Three suits could provide enough cover for 6 vespid and we can give them some defensive measures in the way of shield generators. The vespid would still get their AP3 on and the crisis suits could block incoming fire. Of course, we must assume that the enemy squad is dead, otherwise you would be putting your suits in assault range of some angry poor poor space mole men.

Any of the close-range crisis suits would work well in this role except the ones with flamers. Flamers wont be effective if the vespid are screening your suits during the shooting phase.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#12 » Nov 15 2008 11:40

Ray wrote:
Soji wrote:I am afraid that my favorite Vespid tactic is now useless. I'm talking about the bug screen. Since skimmers now block LoS and skimmer squads count as units who provide cover, if you use this your target will get a 4+ cover save, negating the sole strong point of the Vespids, namely the AP3. Am I missing something ? I hope I am missing something.



Perhaps you can use crisis suits to screen your bugs by jumping ahead of them in the assault phase? Three suits could provide enough cover for 6 vespid and we can give them some defensive measures in the way of shield generators. The vespid would still get their AP3 on and the crisis suits could block incoming fire. Of course, we must assume that the enemy squad is dead, otherwise you would be putting your suits in assault range of some angry poor poor space mole men.

Any of the close-range crisis suits would work well in this role except the ones with flamers. Flamers wont be effective if the vespid are screening your suits during the shooting phase.


Gun Drones can JSJ, and are cheaper, more expendable and with an I4 make better speedbumps.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#13 » Nov 16 2008 01:12

Absintheminded wrote:
Ray wrote:
Soji wrote:I am afraid that my favorite Vespid tactic is now useless. I'm talking about the bug screen. Since skimmers now block LoS and skimmer squads count as units who provide cover, if you use this your target will get a 4+ cover save, negating the sole strong point of the Vespids, namely the AP3. Am I missing something ? I hope I am missing something.



Perhaps you can use crisis suits to screen your bugs by jumping ahead of them in the assault phase? Three suits could provide enough cover for 6 vespid and we can give them some defensive measures in the way of shield generators. The vespid would still get their AP3 on and the crisis suits could block incoming fire. Of course, we must assume that the enemy squad is dead, otherwise you would be putting your suits in assault range of some angry poor poor space mole men.

Any of the close-range crisis suits would work well in this role except the ones with flamers. Flamers wont be effective if the vespid are screening your suits during the shooting phase.


Gun Drones can JSJ, and are cheaper, more expendable and with an I4 make better speedbumps.


I thought of that but realized that they do not provide screening due to their tiny size. They also don't pack the same power as crisis suits and are lacking in the Strength 5 melee department. In 4th edition, gun drones would be a good idea. But all the same, I always take crisis suits so changing their role is easier and cheaper than taking an additional squad with one intended purpose.

editted for detail:

Gun drones are a kill point and are, therefore, not that expendable. They are cheaper but do not 'fit the bill' so-to-speak in terms of killing ability and my idea was not about creating speedbumps for combat but to decimate everything within charge radius of the crisis suits/vespid so that nothing is ever tied up in combat then screen the weaker vespid from incoming fire with the more 'tough' XV8 squad.
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Re: [ATTTAC #1 Submissions] Vespid Stingwings

Post#14 » Nov 17 2008 01:57

I am pretty sure that a squad provide cover wether or not the models behind are hidden, so the size of the drones don't matter. The bug screen great strength was that assault by the targeted unit was impossible, here we are simply initiating the assault ourselves with the I5 bugs (not a new tactic), and a suport unit.
If you are planning the total anihilation of the target, having crisis suits (with PR, since we are using them within 12") provide cover from another unit is not such a bad idea, it helps attacking units in spite of fire support. So it is a completely different tactic, used at different times on different targets and with different benefits, but it deserves our attention.
55/1/0

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