Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Discuss any rules that are confusing or bothering you.
Nymphomanius
Shas
Posts: 118
Contact:

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#19 » Sep 30 2017 01:12

Ok so here is how I see it.

You can accumulate 1 MW per weapon fired.

Those mortal wounds should be treated the same was as a mortal wound caused by an enemy attack I.e you allocate wounds to 1 model at a time until that model dies then roll them over to the next model.

I would not agree that a model dying forsakes his shots as he would fire his guns simultaneously.

Although this can cause a lot of damage IN THEORY our main and biggest asset kind of makes this argument moot point.

If there is 1 markerlight on the target unit a unit of 3 XV8 Crisis Battlesuits with 3 overcharged CIB will fire on average 18 shots on average 0.5 of those will overheat if a markerlight is in play.

So unless you have a unit of 9 which would be a hugely expensive unit you're extremely unlikely to suffer more than 1/2 MW per turn

User avatar
Panzer
Shas'Saal
Posts: 3072

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#20 » Sep 30 2017 03:12

Why is fast dice rolling even a topic now? That's how it has been done all the time and it always has been just a quick solution for rolling everything dice by dice. Even in the past whenever something was not clear to resolve by fast dice rolling we went back to rolling dice by dice. Just remember back on all the times where a character with a 2+ save was in a unit of 3+ save or worse models. Nothing really changed there. ^^

Ricordis
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 323

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#21 » Sep 30 2017 07:11

Uhm, it is per weapon.
If you got 3 CIBs on a XV8, and decide to overload all 3 of them you may get 1 mortal wound for each weapon (so up to 3).

edit: I am too late. Didn't see the 2nd page.

Anyway, you can lose your shooting for a model. The weapon profile clearly says the model suffers a mortal wound after resolving this weapons fire not at the end of the units' firing phase or whatever.
So if you lose your last wound after rolling a 1 you don't have the opportunity to roll for the other weapons you might have wanted to fire. But still the leftover attacks from the same weapon.
If an overcharged CIB with 3 attacks malfunctioned (roll of 1) on the first attack you may resolve the other 2. But if your XV8 lost its' last wound you can't fire your other weapons afterwards.
(Sorry for my bad english; had a long day)

User avatar
Glarblar
Shas'Saal
Posts: 263

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#22 » Oct 01 2017 07:55

I feel like we are all coming to the same conclusion. My original thought is the correct one. The rub is that this makes 1 ML token on the target extremely important because with it you increase your survivability of the unit considerably:
Chance of Mortal wound for overcharged CIB 0ML->1ML
1 shot: 1/6 => 1/36
2 shot: 1/3 => 1/18
3 shot: 1/2 => 1/12

I actually had this affect cause 4 Mortal wounds over 2 rounds of shooting b/c I failed to have markerlight support (bad rolls and I paid for it)

User avatar
Gragagrogog
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 380

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#23 » Oct 01 2017 08:37

Glarblar wrote:Chance of Mortal wound for overcharged CIB 0ML->1ML
1 shot: 1/6 => 1/36
2 shot: 1/3 => 1/18
3 shot: 1/2 => 1/12


The chances don't stack like that for 2 and 3 shots... I did the math here: viewtopic.php?f=44&t=25823&p=326348#p326348

User avatar
Glarblar
Shas'Saal
Posts: 263

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#24 » Oct 01 2017 08:43

It was intended for a single CIB, would these numbers make sense then?

User avatar
Gragagrogog
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 380

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#25 » Oct 01 2017 09:08

No, rolling 6 dice doesn't give you 100% chance of rolling one or more 1s.

I would point you to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binomial_theorem but this isn't exactly the easiest material to learn from, some combinatorics course might be better...

User avatar
Glarblar
Shas'Saal
Posts: 263

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#26 » Oct 01 2017 09:33

ugh, right... Its been so long since I've used this. I feel like a poor engineer now

User avatar
blodgram
Shas
Posts: 1

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#27 » Oct 05 2017 06:08

Draco023 wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:
This is important! If you roll 18 shots for your XV8s, and get 9 ones... it's possible (albeit unlikely) all of those ones were on the same XV8, meaning the squad only takes one wound! It's important to roll separately per suit, or at least different colors of dice.



This is were the rub is coming from. Is it at most 1 mortal wound per model, or per weapon? The weapon listing says it's "after this weapon's shots have been resolved" not " after this model's shots have been resolved". If this is the case, you'd need to roll each weapon separately, not just each model separately. I'm leaning toward each model can take up to 3 wounds( one or more 1 per gun causes one wound), but all the shots still go off. Which leads to the question of mortal wound spill over if the model only had 1 wound left.


Yes the mortal wounds spill over, it talks about it on page 181 of the core rule book.

User avatar
GND
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 87

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#28 » Oct 06 2017 02:51

Excess damage from attacks that cause mortal wounds inflicted upon a unit that you get to allocate spills over.

Overcharging ion weapons causes mortal wounds to individual models, is not an attack and you don't get to allocate the wounds. Also each of them only causes one point of damage. There is nothing that can spill over, and the rule on page 181 doesn't even apply.

A Crisis suit with one wound can only ever kill itself no matter how many ones you roll.

User avatar
Arka0415
Shas'Ui
Shas'Ui
Posts: 1507

Re: Have you been Overcharging your CIBs correctly?

Post#29 » Oct 07 2017 02:37

GND wrote:Excess damage from attacks that cause mortal wounds inflicted upon a unit that you get to allocate spills over.

Overcharging ion weapons causes mortal wounds to individual models, is not an attack and you don't get to allocate the wounds. Also each of them only causes one point of damage. There is nothing that can spill over, and the rule on page 181 doesn't even apply.

A Crisis suit with one wound can only ever kill itself no matter how many ones you roll.

This is important to remember. CIB-caused mortal wounds aren't attacks, and so can't spill over.

Return to “Rules & FAQ”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest