Early warning override use against Reserve models.

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Darthi
Shas
Posts: 47

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#19 » Feb 13 2018 02:15

Muaddib195 wrote:If the shooting happens before the drones and commander separate, how to you handle the difference in Toughness between drones and the Commander? 8e no longer allows mixed toughness units, so I don't think its covered in the rules.

If I Remember it right than deathwatch killteam can have different toughnes.

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Aspiring Commander
Shas'Saal
Posts: 68

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#20 » Feb 13 2018 03:40

Darthi wrote:
Muaddib195 wrote:If the shooting happens before the drones and commander separate, how to you handle the difference in Toughness between drones and the Commander? 8e no longer allows mixed toughness units, so I don't think its covered in the rules.


If I Remember it right than deathwatch killteam can have different toughnes.


Yeah, kill teams can get a bike in them, making a mixed toughness unit. However they have a written rule that you use the toughness of the majority of squad. The bike just grants the ability to fall back and charge in the same turn I think?


I think Yojimbob and nic have summed it up great, player chooses what happens first out of drones splitting and EWO-equivalent triggering, then character rules apply because it is treated 'as it were your shooting phase.'
'We act as one, and united we cannot fall'

-Commander Shadowsun

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Aspiring Commander
Shas'Saal
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Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#21 » Feb 13 2018 03:59

Also, I know this was already fiercely debated in the whole space marine/ drop pod thread but:

Wedrujacy wrote:
Suits and drones deploy together and when deployed start to be two seperate units. So 1d = 1evolved

Sm drops and after them other unit drops. So 2d = 2evolved (1 for each)

question is regarding droppod and sms going out from it. 1 evo for drop pod and then 2nd evo for sms?


The drop pod and squad only should trigger the EWO once!!

The EWO doesn't trigger as a result of a unit being set up nearby- it triggers when a unit is set up as a result of using an ability.

The drop pod deploys as a result of the 'drop pod assault' ability. The squad inside are disembarking, which is not an ability for the squad, but an action that the majority of infantry units are capable of doing. No abilities are gained as a result of being in the drop pod.

This means that the drop pod can be targeted, but the squad inside can't. If you take it as RAW :)
'We act as one, and united we cannot fall'

-Commander Shadowsun

fraction64
Shas'Saal
Posts: 206

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#22 » Feb 13 2018 10:13

As evidence that character targeting rules are still in effect when using EWO the Custodes just got a FAQ and their version of EWO still follows normal character targeting restrictions.

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SinisterSamurai
Kor'La
Kor'La
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Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#23 » Feb 16 2018 10:24

Muaddib195 wrote:If the shooting happens before the drones and commander separate, how to you handle the difference in Toughness between drones and the Commander? 8e no longer allows mixed toughness units, so I don't think its covered in the rules.

There are a few situations I can think of, like Ammo Runts and thundershields. While those may or may not have particular exceptions, I would say that you handle the difference in toughness by resolving the shots one at a time instead of fast rolling. Remember that rolling a bunch of dice at once is the shortcut, not the actual play method.

Aspiring Commander wrote:Also, I know this was already fiercely debated in the whole space marine/ drop pod thread but:

The drop pod and squad only should trigger the EWO once!!

The EWO doesn't trigger as a result of a unit being set up nearby- it triggers when a unit is set up as a result of using an ability.

The drop pod deploys as a result of the 'drop pod assault' ability. The squad inside are disembarking, which is not an ability for the squad, but an action that the majority of infantry units are capable of doing. No abilities are gained as a result of being in the drop pod.

This means that the drop pod can be targeted, but the squad inside can't. If you take it as RAW :)

EWO triggers whenever any unit is set up via an ability, and RAW, two+ units are set up via the Drop Pod's ability: The Drop Pod and the unit inside. While disembarking is a normal unit action, Drop Pod disembarkation is described in, and therefore takes place as a result of, the Drop Pod Assault ability.

Of course this means that because Da Jump is a psychic power and not an ability, we are defenseless against it.

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Aspiring Commander
Shas'Saal
Posts: 68

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#24 » Feb 16 2018 11:18

SinisterSamuari wrote:Of course this means that because Da Jump is a psychic power and not an ability, we are defenseless against it.



It's in the index: Xenos 2 FAQ that we can stop the jump with EWO! :)

Q: Can models with an early warning override Support System use it to shoot at units that use psychic powers such as Gate of In nity or Da Jump to set up within 12"?
A: Yes.



As for the drop pod, I would argue that as it specifies that the modelcan perform drop pod assault, And the unit is just happening to disembark, it would only hit the drop pod.
'We act as one, and united we cannot fall'

-Commander Shadowsun

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Yojimbob
Shas'Saal
Posts: 557

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#25 » Feb 16 2018 11:27

Aspiring Commander wrote:As for the drop pod, I would argue that as it specifies that the modelcan perform drop pod assault, And the unit is just happening to disembark, it would only hit the drop pod.


And I would argue that within the rules of the drop pod states that the unit MUST immediately disembark just like in 7th and our use of EWO. We were able to shoot the guys then under the same rules so it won't stop us now. The only real change is it's interaction with characters. Drop pod drops, guys must get out, then we can shoot models that just came in using an ability. Pretty straight forward.

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Aspiring Commander
Shas'Saal
Posts: 68

Re: Early warning override use against Reserve models.

Post#26 » Feb 16 2018 12:36

Yojimbob wrote:And I would argue that within the rules of the drop pod states that the unit MUST immediately disembark just like in 7th and our use of EWO. We were able to shoot the guys then under the same rules so it won't stop us now. The only real change is it's interaction with characters. Drop pod drops, guys must get out, then we can shoot models that just came in using an ability. Pretty straight forward


Yeah I did some more reading, and I've changed my tune. Shoot them both! I feel like you have to group several rules together throughout the different books and FAQs just to assemble a definite answer! :)
'We act as one, and united we cannot fall'

-Commander Shadowsun

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