Two ATS

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Kerrygan
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Two ATS

Post#1 » Dec 27 2017 03:37

Hello. Can a Suit take two of the same Wargear?
I'm thinking of Coldstar with double ATS. Is it legal?

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Jhul'vol
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Re: Two ATS

Post#2 » Dec 27 2017 04:01

No, if you look at page 137 of your index, underneath the main header "Support Systems" there is a line saying:
"A model cannot have more than one of the saem Support System."

Kerrygan
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Re: Two ATS

Post#3 » Dec 28 2017 10:11

Jhul'vol wrote:No, if you look at page 137 of your index, underneath the main header "Support Systems" there is a line saying:
"A model cannot have more than one of the saem Support System."


Thank you!

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melaniros
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Re: Two ATS

Post#4 » Dec 28 2017 11:10

well. if i have a crisis unit of 3 models and i have armed 2 of them with a drone controller , do the gundrones ,that acoompany the unit , have +2 in their hit rolls, instead of +1?
actually i have the same guestion for every support system with similar abiliies that used this way in a team ....

or if i have 2 ethereals who cast both Sense of Stone ,can a unit double roll to ignore a wound ??

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Shas'la Cali Nate
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Re: Two ATS

Post#5 » Dec 28 2017 01:52

I believe that each effect only applies once to each unit, otherwise things like Volley fire would be ridiculous.

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Arka0415
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Re: Two ATS

Post#6 » Dec 28 2017 08:07

melaniros wrote:well. if i have a crisis unit of 3 models and i have armed 2 of them with a drone controller , do the gundrones ,that acoompany the unit , have +2 in their hit rolls, instead of +1?
actually i have the same guestion for every support system with similar abiliies that used this way in a team ....

or if i have 2 ethereals who cast both Sense of Stone ,can a unit double roll to ignore a wound ??

For units like Ethereals and Fireblades, and for wargear like Drone Controllers, the wording is such that the buffs do not stack.

For some armies it's possible to get stacking buffs, but our characters cannot do it.

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melaniros
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Re: Two ATS

Post#7 » Dec 29 2017 02:24

Arka0415 wrote:
melaniros wrote:well. if i have a crisis unit of 3 models and i have armed 2 of them with a drone controller , do the gundrones ,that acoompany the unit , have +2 in their hit rolls, instead of +1?
actually i have the same guestion for every support system with similar abiliies that used this way in a team ....

or if i have 2 ethereals who cast both Sense of Stone ,can a unit double roll to ignore a wound ??

For units like Ethereals and Fireblades, and for wargear like Drone Controllers, the wording is such that the buffs do not stack.

For some armies it's possible to get stacking buffs, but our characters cannot do it.


ok... so if a firewarrior unit has the ability to re roll a 1' because the target has been hit with a marketlight and at the same time has been affected by an ethereal with Storm of Fire so it can reeoll 1' , it will do it just one time?

and generally speaking for our army ...what the outcome of same kinds of buffs which come from different abilities...

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Jhul'vol
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Re: Two ATS

Post#8 » Dec 29 2017 03:36

ok... so if a firewarrior unit has the ability to re roll a 1' because the target has been hit with a marketlight and at the same time has been affected by an ethereal with Storm of Fire so it can reeoll 1' , it will do it just one time?


Correct, but that's because of the basic rule that you can reroll a dice only once.


and generally speaking for our army ...what the outcome of same kinds of buffs which come from different abilities...


Best example of this one for Tau I think is the Ethereal's Sense of Stone and a battlesuit with the Stimulant Injector. Because they are different rules, they can stack. So when you lose a wound you have 2 rolls of a 6+ to ignore it.

In general, if the rule has a different name, they stack. In some cases, like the new Blood Angel book, the rules state you can have on or another, but then this is made clear.

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melaniros
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Re: Two ATS

Post#9 » Dec 29 2017 04:08

Jhul'vol wrote:
ok... so if a firewarrior unit has the ability to re roll a 1' because the target has been hit with a marketlight and at the same time has been affected by an ethereal with Storm of Fire so it can reeoll 1' , it will do it just one time?


Correct, but that's because of the basic rule that you can reroll a dice only once.


and generally speaking for our army ...what the outcome of same kinds of buffs which come from different abilities...


Best example of this one for Tau I think is the Ethereal's Sense of Stone and a battlesuit with the Stimulant Injector. Because they are different rules, they can stack. So when you lose a wound you have 2 rolls of a 6+ to ignore it.

In general, if the rule has a different name, they stack. In some cases, like the new Blood Angel book, the rules state you can have on or another, but then this is made clear.


Mmm... isn't the "ignored wound rol" rolled twice in this example? According to the core rule "of reroll a dice only once " this extra roll shouldn't allowed here too? I asked it because in both examples rolling of the same buff is coming from different abilities but the first is not allowed ti reroll twice, while the second is alliwed...


It seems i really need to read the rulebook again...

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Arka0415
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Re: Two ATS

Post#10 » Dec 29 2017 04:30

melaniros wrote:Mmm... isn't the "ignored wound rol" rolled twice in this example? According to the core rule "of reroll a dice only once " this extra roll shouldn't allowed here too? I asked it because in both examples rolling of the same buff is coming from different abilities but the first is not allowed ti reroll twice, while the second is alliwed...

It seems i really need to read the rulebook again...

In this case, you're not re-rolling any dice. You're rolling a new dice for each unsaved wound. Let's look at the two abilities:

Sense of Stone:
All friendly Tau Empire Infantry and Tau Empire Battlesuits within 6" of any Ethereal invoking an elemental power gain that power's benefit until the start of your next turn.

Sense of Stone: Whenever an affected unit suffers an unsaved wound, roll a D6. On a 6, that wound is ignored.


Stimulant Injector:
Roll a dice each time a model with a Stimulant Injector suffers a wound or mortal wound. On a roll of 6, ignore it.


For each unsaved wound, you're not re-rolling the Armor Save dice. Rather, you're rolling an entirely new D6 each time.

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melaniros
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Re: Two ATS

Post#11 » Dec 29 2017 06:38

Ahh right.. i got it...it's not the dame dice... ok thanks a lot... it was really buffled me...

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Beerson
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Re: Two ATS

Post#12 » Dec 30 2017 05:10

Just a little clarification, with stim injectors you are not rolling to ignore the wound but to gain the wound back, so if they for instance made a rule that you can't ignore a wound on given shot, our battlesuits would still be able to do that with stims

Kerrygan
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Posts: 122

Re: Two ATS

Post#13 » Dec 30 2017 04:15

Beerson wrote:Just a little clarification, with stim injectors you are not rolling to ignore the wound but to gain the wound back, so if they for instance made a rule that you can't ignore a wound on given shot, our battlesuits would still be able to do that with stims


Hello, Beerson. In my Index the text says: "Roll a dice each time a model with a stimulant injector suffers a wound or mortal wound. On a roll of 6, ignore it."

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AnonAmbientLight
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Re: Two ATS

Post#14 » Dec 31 2017 12:48

Unless otherwise stated buffs do not stack. I think that the developer notes said this.
Sky IS Falling, T'au WILL Suck, Sell Me Your Models

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Arka0415
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Re: Two ATS

Post#15 » Dec 31 2017 12:55

AnonAmbientLight wrote:Unless otherwise stated buffs do not stack. I think that the developer notes said this.

I seem to recall reading that. Though while buffs with the same name don't stack, though buffs with the same effect do.

Nymphomanius
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Re: Two ATS

Post#16 » Dec 31 2017 10:29

Arka0415 wrote:
AnonAmbientLight wrote:Unless otherwise stated buffs do not stack. I think that the developer notes said this.

I seem to recall reading that. Though while buffs with the same name don't stack, though buffs with the same effect do.


It's in either a designer comments or early 8th FAQ someone asked if they stack specifically I think they mentioned an ability caused by the eldar psychic power amd warlord trait or nurgle ability and warlord trait either way they confirmed that unless the ability specifically states it doesn't stack, then it does, so a T'au Commander in cover with a shield generator, stim injector, warlord with 6+ ability and buffed by an ethereal would get either 2+/4++ and 3x6+++

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StealthKnightSteg
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Re: Two ATS

Post#17 » Dec 31 2017 10:37

in WARHAMMER 40,000, RULEBOOK, Official Update Version 1.1

Q: If a model has two rules that allow it to ignore wounds, such
as the Disgustingly Resilient ability and the Tenacious Survivor
Warlord Trait, can I use them both?
A: Unless stated otherwise, yes.
For example, if a model had the two aforementioned
abilities and lost a wound, you could roll a D6 due to
the Disgustingly Resilient ability and on a roll of 5+ that
wound would be ignored. If you rolled less than 5, you
could then roll another D6 because of the Tenacious
Survivor Warlord Trait, and this time the wound would
be ignored on a 6.

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Beerson
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Re: Two ATS

Post#18 » Dec 31 2017 06:41

Kerrygan wrote:
Beerson wrote:Just a little clarification, with stim injectors you are not rolling to ignore the wound but to gain the wound back, so if they for instance made a rule that you can't ignore a wound on given shot, our battlesuits would still be able to do that with stims


Hello, Beerson. In my Index the text says: "Roll a dice each time a model with a stimulant injector suffers a wound or mortal wound. On a roll of 6, ignore it."

I'd expect that to be FAQ'd once the rule about not saving rules was produced, the mechanic stays the same, you are gaining the wounding back, just the wording makes it simpler and eliminates " if that wound would kill the model" kind of debates

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