Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Discuss any rules that are confusing or bothering you.
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JancoBCN
Shas'Saal
Posts: 106

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#19 » Jan 25 2018 09:32

Arka0415 wrote:Games Workshop has confirmed that all of these abilities ignore damage, not wounds. Sense of Stone, Stimulant Injector, Tenacious Survivor, all of this works on the total caused damage.


Really???? OMG!! :P :P Finally something from them! Do you have any sources?

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Arka0415
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 3168

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#20 » Jan 25 2018 06:48

JancoBCN wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:Games Workshop has confirmed that all of these abilities ignore damage, not wounds. Sense of Stone, Stimulant Injector, Tenacious Survivor, all of this works on the total caused damage.

Really???? OMG!! :P :P Finally something from them! Do you have any sources?


Q: Can abilities such as Disgustingly Resilient be used to ignore
wounds if they were inflicted by mortal wounds?
A: Yes.


Q: If a model has two rules that allow it to ignore wounds, such
as the Disgustingly Resilient ability and the Tenacious Survivor
Warlord Trait, can I use them both?
A: Unless stated otherwise, yes.
For example, if a model had the two aforementioned
abilities and lost a wound, you could roll a D6 due to
the Disgustingly Resilient ability and on a roll of 5+ that
wound would be ignored. If you rolled less than 5, you
could then roll another D6 because of the Tenacious
Survivor Warlord Trait, and this time the wound would
be ignored on a 6.


Q: When rolling for abilities such as
‘Disgustingly Resilient’ or ‘Tenacious
Survivor’ against attacks which inflict
multiple wounds, do you roll to ignore
each individual wound inflicted by the
attack, or do you roll only once to ignore
all the wounds inflicted by the attack?
A: Roll to avoid each wound lost separately.
For example, if a model with Disgustingly
Resilient fails its saving throw against an attack
made by a thunder hammer (Damage 3), you
would roll three dice and for each result of 5+
you would ignore a single wound.

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QimRas
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 387

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#21 » Jan 25 2018 07:21

Kind of a tangent, but I propose we call these kinds of abilities "Damage Saves" as opposed to FnP. I feel like that is easier to understand for people new to the game.

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Arka0415
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Posts: 3168

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#22 » Jan 25 2018 07:23

QimRas wrote:Kind of a tangent, but I propose we call these kinds of abilities "Damage Saves" as opposed to FnP. I feel like that is easier to understand for people new to the game.

I agree that a term is needed. However, calling them "saves" might not help since things that ignore saves do not ignore them. I've seen people use "shrug", "FNP", "ignore damage ability", among others.

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QimRas
Shas'La
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Posts: 387

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#23 » Jan 25 2018 07:32

Arka0415 wrote:
QimRas wrote:Kind of a tangent, but I propose we call these kinds of abilities "Damage Saves" as opposed to FnP. I feel like that is easier to understand for people new to the game.

I agree that a term is needed. However, calling them "saves" might not help since things that ignore saves do not ignore them. I've seen people use "shrug", "FNP", "ignore damage ability", among others.


I think "ignore damage ability" is the most descriptive, but also a mouth full.

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Arka0415
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Posts: 3168

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#24 » Jan 25 2018 07:45

QimRas wrote:I think "ignore damage ability" is the most descriptive, but also a mouth full.

Yeah. It's a bit of an odd situation- removing the names of abilities makes discussing things a little trickier. Even GW needs to say things like "abilities such as Disgustingly Resilient" and "abilities that allow models to set up outside of 9" of enemy models". I understand the flavor of giving each ability a unique name, but, it makes it difficult to discuss them in general.

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SniperTau
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 227

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#25 » Jan 25 2018 07:51

Perhaps instead of ignore damage ability just IDA? We already have so many other contractions for rules(FTGG for for the greater good among others) and wargear(CIB,BC, DBBC, PR, RR) that it almost makes sense

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QimRas
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 387

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#26 » Jan 25 2018 08:02

SniperTau wrote:Perhaps instead of ignore damage ability just IDA? We already have so many other contractions for rules(FTGG for for the greater good among others) and wargear(CIB,BC, DBBC, PR, RR) that it almost makes sense


Need to be careful with that, since you end up with an acronym without a reference point. FtGG, CIB, BC, etc are all terms in the book, so can be guessed as long as you've read the index. Whatever we call a damage save is something that needs to be descriptive enough to be understood intuitively because it won't really be referenced anywhere in the rules.

Its a general enough rule that it needs a name though. Same with -1 to hits, though I guess you can just call it Hard to Hit like on flyers.

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JancoBCN
Shas'Saal
Posts: 106

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#27 » Jan 26 2018 03:21

Arka0415 wrote:
JancoBCN wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:Games Workshop has confirmed that all of these abilities ignore damage, not wounds. Sense of Stone, Stimulant Injector, Tenacious Survivor, all of this works on the total caused damage.

Really???? OMG!! :P :P Finally something from them! Do you have any sources?


Q: Can abilities such as Disgustingly Resilient be used to ignore
wounds if they were inflicted by mortal wounds?
A: Yes.


Q: If a model has two rules that allow it to ignore wounds, such
as the Disgustingly Resilient ability and the Tenacious Survivor
Warlord Trait, can I use them both?
A: Unless stated otherwise, yes.
For example, if a model had the two aforementioned
abilities and lost a wound, you could roll a D6 due to
the Disgustingly Resilient ability and on a roll of 5+ that
wound would be ignored. If you rolled less than 5, you
could then roll another D6 because of the Tenacious
Survivor Warlord Trait, and this time the wound would
be ignored on a 6.


Q: When rolling for abilities such as
‘Disgustingly Resilient’ or ‘Tenacious
Survivor’ against attacks which inflict
multiple wounds, do you roll to ignore
each individual wound inflicted by the
attack, or do you roll only once to ignore
all the wounds inflicted by the attack?
A: Roll to avoid each wound lost separately.
For example, if a model with Disgustingly
Resilient fails its saving throw against an attack
made by a thunder hammer (Damage 3), you
would roll three dice and for each result of 5+
you would ignore a single wound.



Oh, that... But, I actually thing both our Sense of Stone and Stimulant Injector wording have nothing to do with those that mention in the FAQs.... I will continue playing before damage, as we will only have to wait for a month or so to get new wordings and FAQs :D :D :D

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Arka0415
Shas'Vre
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Posts: 3168

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#28 » Jan 26 2018 03:26

JancoBCN wrote:Oh, that... But, I actually thing both our Sense of Stone and Stimulant Injector wording have nothing to do with those that mention in the FAQs.... I will continue playing before damage, as we will only have to wait for a month or so to get new wordings and FAQs :D :D :D

Directly post on the FB page and you'll get an answer within a few days. I asked months ago, but old posts are buried/deleted so the response isn't there anymore I think. Feel free to ask again if you want.

User avatar
JancoBCN
Shas'Saal
Posts: 106

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#29 » Jan 26 2018 03:45

Arka0415 wrote:
JancoBCN wrote:Oh, that... But, I actually thing both our Sense of Stone and Stimulant Injector wording have nothing to do with those that mention in the FAQs.... I will continue playing before damage, as we will only have to wait for a month or so to get new wordings and FAQs :D :D :D

Directly post on the FB page and you'll get an answer within a few days. I asked months ago, but old posts are buried/deleted so the response isn't there anymore I think. Feel free to ask again if you want.


I did, but was not answered.... My post was (with an introduction):

Regarding the rules of the Stimulant Injector support system from the T'au (Index: Xenos 2, pg. 137), when it says "each time a model with Stimulant Injector suffers a wound or mortal wound", does it mean…?:
1- when an enemy attack successfully wounds it you have to allocate that wound and make that roll. Before saves and damages.
2- you have to make the saving throw first, then apply damage, and for each wound the model with Stimulant Injector would lose, you make a roll. (like “Disgustingly Resilient”, or Tenatious survivor Warlord trait)
3- You take the saving throw first, and then you make the roll for each non-saved wounds, before damage is applied. (like “Sense of stone”, from T’au Ethereal)

I wanted to ask them again, but with the codex now I really don't want to :D

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Studioworks
Shas'Saal
Posts: 164

Re: Sense of Stone. FnP or not?

Post#30 » Jan 26 2018 03:47

That could actually be cool. Surround the Riptide with XV-8 and tons of Drones, take Stimulant Injector and put an Ethereal in the middle of the formation and play offensively. Could be fun. Two times rolling 6 for damage for the Riptide and once for Crisis.

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