Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

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Arka0415
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Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#1 » Jul 31 2017 08:07

8th Edition Army List





I'm posting this here more for record, but if you have any advice on how I can develop this list please let me know. I've used this list plenty of times now, so I'm quite used to playing it at this point. My plan is to use a traditional mixed-gunline style army while we have an Index, and once the true Codex comes out I'll start thinking about how Tau can truly become competitive. Without further ado:

Note: This list is organized by tactical function, not by detachment or by unit type.





Gunline:
HQ - Aun'va, Master of the Undying Spirit; 2x Ethereal Honour Guard (75)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Troops - Strike Team; 9x Fire Warriors w/ Markerlight (75)
Troops - Strike Team; 9x Fire Warriors w/ Markerlight (75)
Troops - Strike Team; 9x Fire Warriors w/ Markerlight (75)

Interdiction:
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 6x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 3x ATS; 5x Gun Drones, 1x Marker Drone (308)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 9x Flamers; 5x Gun Drones, 1x Marker Drone (257)

Fire Support:
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ Fusion Blaster, 2x Burst Cannons, Homing Beacon (121)
Fast Attack - 7x Pathfinders w/ 4x Markerlights, 3x Rail Rifles (113)
Fast Attack - 7x Pathfinders w/ 7x Markerlights (56)

Mechanized Support:
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (201)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight; 2x Gun Drones (58)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones (32)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)

Total: 2003 - Command Points: 8

Battalion Detachment (3 CP) - Aun'va, Fireblade, 3x Strike Teams
Vanguard Detachment (1 CP) - Commander, Commander, 2x XV8 Teams, Stealthsuit Team
Outrider Detachment (1 CP) - Longstrike, Fireblade, 2x Pathfinder Teams, 2x Tactical Drone Teams, Devilfish





If it helps with thinking about list-building, here's my collection:

Full Collection:
Spoiler!
1x Aun'va
2x Ethereal Honour Guard
3x Ethereals
1x Shadowsun
3x Commanders
1x Darkstrider
2x Cadre Fireblades
1x Longstrike
36x Fire Warriors
3x Support Turrets
6x XV8s
3x Stealthsuits
21x Pathfinders
28x Gun Drones
12x Shield Drones
4x Marker Drones
1x Devilfish
3x Broadsides
2x Hammerhead Gunships






Tau'va!
Last edited by Arka0415 on Nov 22 2017 07:18, edited 33 times in total.

Jburli
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#2 » Aug 01 2017 06:55

Looks awesome Arka!

If I were playing it I would think about splitting the fire warriors into squads of 8-10 (for morale reasons), I'm sure I could keep them in range of the characters even with the smaller team sizes.
Then again many area of effect abilities (such as the new space marine orbital bombardment I saw yesterday) inflict mortal wounds per unit in range, so maybe not. Worth deliberating over, anyway.

Also I personally love the utility of pathfinder grav inhibit and pulse accel drones, so I'd likely place a full cohort of pathfinder drones (inc recon and 2x shield) right in my gunline. Obviously I would expect them to get shot at, but they are slightly cheaper per wound than firewarriors and a lot more durable, so I consider it a win/win :)

I'm currently running the same as you: a full squad of pathfinders with 3 rail rifles. Not sure about this though, it takes the average price of the unit from 8pts per model to about 14pts per model :-( making them a costly loss if the enemy focus-fires on them (and why wouldn't they?)

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#3 » Aug 02 2017 10:06

Jburli wrote:If I were playing it I would think about splitting the fire warriors into squads of 8-10 (for morale reasons), I'm sure I could keep them in range of the characters even with the smaller team sizes.
Then again many area of effect abilities (such as the new space marine orbital bombardment I saw yesterday) inflict mortal wounds per unit in range, so maybe not. Worth deliberating over, anyway.


You're right, and I'd definitely make that change under normal circumstances! Here's my reasoning though. First, the number of drops in this list is pretty high- the 12-model squads increase the likelihood (fractionally) of getting first turn. Second, I have Aun'va, who will be buffing all of those units, and I plan on making him my Warlord with the Inspiring Leader trait, giving all of those Fire Warriors a re-rollable LD10 with auto-passes on 6, and if need be I can also give them Calm of Tides, which would functonally be a re-rollable LD11 with auto-passes on 6. I don't think LD is going to be a problem :P

Jburli wrote:Also I personally love the utility of pathfinder grav inhibit and pulse accel drones, so I'd likely place a full cohort of pathfinder drones (inc recon and 2x shield) right in my gunline. Obviously I would expect them to get shot at, but they are slightly cheaper per wound than firewarriors and a lot more durable, so I consider it a win/win :)

I'm currently running the same as you: a full squad of pathfinders with 3 rail rifles. Not sure about this though, it takes the average price of the unit from 8pts per model to about 14pts per model :-( making them a costly loss if the enemy focus-fires on them (and why wouldn't they?)


Yeah, this is something I've really been thinking about. By dropping the Pathfinders, I could easily add a squad of Drones to support those Fire Warriors, reducing enemy charge range and increasing the Fire Warriors' range... but those Rail Rifles are sweet, aren't they? Hard decisions.

Jburli
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#4 » Aug 02 2017 10:55

Yep, morale's not an issue then!

And after a really hard game yesterday against primaris I now believe that rail rifles are worth their weight in gold, we need all the armour-piercing multi-wound weapons we can get!
The redemptor dreadnought wiped most of my pathfinders first turn, but the ones with the rifles lived on, and were just about the only things that could hurt primaris in cover.

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#5 » Aug 02 2017 11:13

Jburli wrote:And after a really hard game yesterday against primaris I now believe that rail rifles are worth their weight in gold, we need all the armour-piercing multi-wound weapons we can get!
The redemptor dreadnought wiped most of my pathfinders first turn, but the ones with the rifles lived on, and were just about the only things that could hurt primaris in cover.


Ooh, that's good to know. I have yet to try mine out (still not fully assembled) but I'm looking forward to seeing them in battle.

Rathstar
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#6 » Sep 04 2017 11:04

Very nice list, just a few small points to consider.

I have always loved the concept of rail rifles, and was ecstatic to see them get such a strong profile in 8th. However they are very expensive, and once an opponent is on the receiving end of a volley (particularly if you get any extra mortal wounds) they are normally dead the next turn, and that's only if they didn't ask what rail rifles did before the game started.

Another issue is that most people are still partially in their 7th edition tactics mindset when it comes to target priority, and when playing against Tau the common tactic for the last few editions has been to kill the markerlights making pathfinders still an early target of enemy firepower.

3 Pathfinders with Railrifles are over half the cost of a Quad Fusion Commander (QFC), I just find 3 T3 wounds with a 5+ save too fragile to put such expensive weapons on. I'd advise keeping the pathfinders small with markerlights only or adding cheap Ion Rifles. For the cost of the 3 rail rifles you could give both pathfinder units 3 ion rifles and have 33 points spare. At long range you would have 12 (overcharge) shots to the rail rifles 3, although at lower AP and Damage - and requiring a markerlight to reduce the pathfinders killing themselves :)

I completely agree with your statement that we need as much low AP weapons, I just think commanders, crisis suits and broadsides, protected by drones is a better and more survivable source.

Lastly to diversify your markerlight sources, how about giving the 4 firewarrior shas'uis markerlights (for the cost of 1.5 pathfinders). If your pathfinders get focused on they can be reserve markerlights, and if not they can still fire their pulse rifle. This could allow you to reduce the number of markerlights you have towards getting a 2nd Quad Fusion Commander after removing the railrifles:
Reduce both pathfinder units to 5 (with just markerlights) = 106 pts saved (2/3rds of the way towards a QFC)

Rathstar

Larlock
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#7 » Sep 04 2017 11:30

I feel though that the gunline of firewarriors are so fragile and immobile. They technically have to stay still in their buff bubble to be effective. I played a similar list against Adeptus Mechanicus the other week and he blaster my fire warriors to dust before I had a chance to make good use of them.

The cardre fireblades buff only works if they are within half range. And if you have an immobile blob of 40+ models, no enemy is going to walk in to range. I don't know. It looks good on paper, but feels like it will be hard to pull off.

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#8 » Sep 04 2017 07:02

Rathstar wrote:I have always loved the concept of rail rifles, and was ecstatic to see them get such a strong profile in 8th. However they are very expensive, and once an opponent is on the receiving end of a volley (particularly if you get any extra mortal wounds) they are normally dead the next turn, and that's only if they didn't ask what rail rifles did before the game started.

Another issue is that most people are still partially in their 7th edition tactics mindset when it comes to target priority, and when playing against Tau the common tactic for the last few editions has been to kill the markerlights making pathfinders still an early target of enemy firepower.

3 Pathfinders with Railrifles are over half the cost of a Quad Fusion Commander (QFC), I just find 3 T3 wounds with a 5+ save too fragile to put such expensive weapons on. I'd advise keeping the pathfinders small with markerlights only or adding cheap Ion Rifles. For the cost of the 3 rail rifles you could give both pathfinder units 3 ion rifles and have 33 points spare. At long range you would have 12 (overcharge) shots to the rail rifles 3, although at lower AP and Damage - and requiring a markerlight to reduce the pathfinders killing themselves :)

See, here's the thing- you're right. Small Pathfinder squads can be killed pretty easily, and expensive Rail Rifles make for quite the priority target. However, there's just so much utility in Rail Rifles that I'm unsure about giving them up. I actually haven't had an opponent shoot at them yet (a combination of long range and other priority targets, I guess) but I'll keep your advice in mind.

Rathstar wrote:Lastly to diversify your markerlight sources, how about giving the 4 firewarrior shas'uis markerlights (for the cost of 1.5 pathfinders). If your pathfinders get focused on they can be reserve markerlights, and if not they can still fire their pulse rifle. This could allow you to reduce the number of markerlights you have towards getting a 2nd Quad Fusion Commander after removing the railrifles:
Reduce both pathfinder units to 5 (with just markerlights) = 106 pts saved (2/3rds of the way towards a QFC)

A second Fusion Commander would be fantastic, wouldn't it! In my experience so far one Fusion Commander has done the trick, but fitting in a second would add a huge punch. I do have a 3rd Commander model, but I wonder if changing the loadout on an XV8 squad might be better than dropping Pathfinders? What do you think?

Larlock wrote:I feel though that the gunline of firewarriors are so fragile and immobile. They technically have to stay still in their buff bubble to be effective. I played a similar list against Adeptus Mechanicus the other week and he blaster my fire warriors to dust before I had a chance to make good use of them.

The cardre fireblades buff only works if they are within half range. And if you have an immobile blob of 40+ models, no enemy is going to walk in to range. I don't know. It looks good on paper, but feels like it will be hard to pull off.

Actually, nothing requires Fire Warriors to stay still, except for the Invocation. The gunline can advance very rapidly using Invocations, and when it stands still gains increased firepower. Plus, the Fireblade can run around behind the line to make sure his bubble touches every squad. Once I move 5" or 6" up the board to a good firing position, almost all enemies end up within that deadly 15" range. If the enemy stays back, that's a win too.
The fun part about using this army is that it looks like a gunline, but the real punch comes with the battlesuits. Setting up a large gunline tactically defines the engagement as a defensive one, when in reality uses a heavy aggressive flank using battlesuits.

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Panzer
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#9 » Sep 05 2017 11:16

Ever since my Rail Rifle Pathfinder obliterated a unit of Deathwatch who dared to consolidate too far into their direction my already decent opinion of them improved even more. Never regreted taking Rail Rifles since 8th edition got released no matter what the mathhammer says. ^^

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#10 » Oct 07 2017 09:05

List Update:

-6 Fire Warriors (-48)
-8 Gun Drones (-64)

+3 Stealthsuits (+90)
+1 Homing Beacon (+20)

With so many units that can arrive via Manta Strike, I'm starting to think that Stealthsuits will be an important part of this list.

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#11 » Oct 31 2017 01:01

We've been talking a lot about mechanized units recently. Any thoughts on adding a Devilfish and some Gun Drones to this list? Seems like the right thing to do:

-

HQ - Aun’va, Master of the Undying Spirit; 2x Ethereal Honour Guard (75)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Gun Drones, 2x Seeker Missiles (201)
Troops - 9x Fire Warriors (72)
Troops - 9x Fire Warriors (72)
Troops - 9x Fire Warriors (72)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (137)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 6x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 3x ATS; 6x Gun Drones (306)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 6x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 3x ATS; 6x Gun Drones (306)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, Homing Beacon (110)
Fast Attack - 7x Pathfinders w/ 4x Markerlights, 3x Ion Rifles (68)
Fast Attack - 7x Pathfinders w/ 7x Markerlights (56)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)

Total: 1999 - CP: 8 (1 Battalion Detachment, 1 Vanguard Detachment, 1 Outrider Detachment)

-

Longstrike is using Gun Drones, as they may potentially detach to go assist the Devilfish. I wish I could add more Fire Warriors and Pathfinders to this list though.

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StealthKnightSteg
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#12 » Nov 02 2017 11:02

is worth it to have the Seekers on the Devilfish? could save some point to invest in another Firewarrior or pathfinder

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Panzer
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#13 » Nov 02 2017 11:07

StealthKnightSteg wrote:is worth it to have the Seekers on the Devilfish? could save some point to invest in another Firewarrior or pathfinder

Only if you can ensure 3 Markerlight hits on the target even after the enemies alpha strike in case you go second. The Devilfish normally wants to keep moving and that would make him hit the Seekers only on 5+ (or worse depending on the target) without the third bonus.

With only 14 Pathfinder and not even all of them with Markerlights....I'd say against a competent opponent there won't be many left after the first turn if you go second. At least according to me experience and we aren't even playing over competetive lists in my group.

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Arka0415
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#14 » Nov 03 2017 09:11

Panzer wrote:
StealthKnightSteg wrote:is worth it to have the Seekers on the Devilfish? could save some point to invest in another Firewarrior or pathfinder

Only if you can ensure 3 Markerlight hits on the target even after the enemies alpha strike in case you go second. The Devilfish normally wants to keep moving and that would make him hit the Seekers only on 5+ (or worse depending on the target) without the third bonus.

With only 14 Pathfinder and not even all of them with Markerlights....I'd say against a competent opponent there won't be many left after the first turn if you go second. At least according to me experience and we aren't even playing over competetive lists in my group.


What would you do, Panzer? Besides Pathfinders I don't see a viable alpha-proof Markerlight source in the Index.

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Panzer
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#15 » Nov 03 2017 09:15

Arka0415 wrote:
Panzer wrote:
StealthKnightSteg wrote:is worth it to have the Seekers on the Devilfish? could save some point to invest in another Firewarrior or pathfinder

Only if you can ensure 3 Markerlight hits on the target even after the enemies alpha strike in case you go second. The Devilfish normally wants to keep moving and that would make him hit the Seekers only on 5+ (or worse depending on the target) without the third bonus.

With only 14 Pathfinder and not even all of them with Markerlights....I'd say against a competent opponent there won't be many left after the first turn if you go second. At least according to me experience and we aren't even playing over competetive lists in my group.


What would you do, Panzer? Besides Pathfinders I don't see a viable alpha-proof Markerlight source in the Index.

There are non. Our only chance is redundancy or hope the board offers enough LoS blocking so we can move out of cover and hit Markerlights on 5+. :neutral:

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Draaen
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#16 » Nov 03 2017 09:39

The markerlights that can survive an alpha strike in your list almost certainly would be your fireblades due to being a character. I have been trying out giving my fire warrior Shas'ui the markerlight upgrade as a rugged markerlight source due to their lower target priority and numbers. If you dropped a drone you can add 3 markerlights across your fire warrior squads. Early game they may help you hit 5 markerlights before your pathfinders get blown off. Late game when you realistically won't hit anything more meaningful then re-roll 1's they would handy to have so you can optimize your shooting on as many units as possible.
All empires fall you just have to know where to push

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Yojimbob
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#17 » Nov 03 2017 09:47

Draaen wrote:The markerlights that can survive an alpha strike in your list almost certainly would be your fireblades due to being a character. I have been trying out giving my fire warrior Shas'ui the markerlight upgrade as a rugged markerlight source due to their lower target priority and numbers. If you dropped a drone you can add 3 markerlights across your fire warrior squads. Early game they may help you hit 5 markerlights before your pathfinders get blown off. Late game when you realistically won't hit anything more meaningful then re-roll 1's they would handy to have so you can optimize your shooting on as many units as possible.


^^This is why I hide markerlights in min squad strike teams. EVERY. TIME.

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Panzer
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Re: Arka0415's 8th Edition Amy List

Post#18 » Nov 03 2017 10:21

Bummer that I decided to take as few Strike Teams as possible. Maybe I need to take more Marksmen then. :D

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