Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

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Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Posts: 127

Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#1 » Aug 03 2017 12:51

This is for a all-airborne offensive force using razorsharks, ghostkeels, drones, crisis suits and pirahnas. It is designed for a all-arial battle with unlimited points, but a Power Level limit of 125. Designed for dogfighting. Opinions needed.


++ Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [32 PL, 718pts] ++

+ HQ +

Commander [6 PL, 163pts]: 2x Cyclic ion blaster, 2x Missile pod

XV86 Coldstar Commander [8 PL, 157pts]: Drone controller, High-output burst cannon, Missile pod, Velocity tracker
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine

XV86 Coldstar Commander [8 PL, 160pts]: High-output burst cannon, Missile pod, Shield generator, Velocity tracker
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine

+ Elites +

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit [10 PL, 238pts]: Fusion collider, 2x MV5 Stealth Drone, Shield generator, Velocity tracker
. 2 fusion blasters: 2x Fusion blaster

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [53 PL, 1170pts] ++

+ HQ +

XV86 Coldstar Commander [8 PL, 158pts]: High-output burst cannon, Missile pod, Target lock, Velocity tracker
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine

+ Elites +

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [11 PL, 264pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui: Cyclic ion blaster, Missile pod, Velocity tracker
. Crisis Shas'ui: Cyclic ion blaster, Missile pod, Velocity tracker
. Crisis Shas'ui: Cyclic ion blaster, Missile pod, Velocity tracker

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit [10 PL, 206pts]: Advanced targeting system, Fusion collider, 2x MV5 Stealth Drone, Velocity tracker
. 2 fusion blasters: 2x Fusion blaster

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit [10 PL, 238pts]: Fusion collider, 2x MV5 Stealth Drone, Shield generator, Velocity tracker
. 2 fusion blasters: 2x Fusion blaster

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit [10 PL, 238pts]: Fusion collider, 2x MV5 Stealth Drone, Shield generator, Velocity tracker
. 2 fusion blasters: 2x Fusion blaster

+ Fast Attack +

TX4 Piranhas [4 PL, 66pts]
. TX4 Piranha: Burst cannon
. . 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine

++ Air Wing Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [40 PL, 748pts] ++

+ Flyer +

AX3 Razorshark Strike Fighter [8 PL, 142pts]: Burst cannon, Quad ion turret, 2x Seeker missile

AX3 Razorshark Strike Fighter [8 PL, 142pts]: Burst cannon, Quad ion turret, 2x Seeker missile

AX3 Razorshark Strike Fighter [8 PL, 142pts]: Burst cannon, Quad ion turret, 2x Seeker missile

AX3 Razorshark Strike Fighter [8 PL, 161pts]: Missile pod, Quad ion turret, 2x Seeker missile

AX3 Razorshark Strike Fighter [8 PL, 161pts]: Missile pod, Quad ion turret, 2x Seeker missile

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 2652

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#2 » Aug 03 2017 01:07

Okay without even looking or thinking about the details....replace your Razorsharks with Sunsharks. Seriously. :D

Sonnenkoenig
Shas
Posts: 7

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#3 » Aug 03 2017 07:05

Just one quick question: Is it allowed to play more than one Coldstar Commanders? Apart from never having fielded one, it might be "outdated 7th. edition thinking", where the Coldstar was a sig sys just as the Iridium armor was.

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 2652

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#4 » Aug 03 2017 07:24

Sonnenkoenig wrote:Just one quick question: Is it allowed to play more than one Coldstar Commanders? Apart from never having fielded one, it might be "outdated 7th. edition thinking", where the Coldstar was a sig sys just as the Iridium armor was.

Even in 7th you could play more than one Coldstar. It never was a sig system, it just prevented you from taking sig systems. ;)

Sonnenkoenig
Shas
Posts: 7

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#5 » Aug 03 2017 09:40

Oh...it was of so little interest for me that I forgot about it... ;)

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Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Posts: 127

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#6 » Aug 03 2017 04:55

In reply to the comment about razorshaks, the sunshark can only use pulse bombs against ground troops. Razorsharks do not have that limitation for their quad turrets
To Boldly Go where no Tau has gone before...

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Bloodknife92
Shas'La
Posts: 498

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#7 » Aug 03 2017 05:39

This is the 5th Cadre topic you've posted during 8th edition Vior'la Mal'caor, and while there's no limit on how many topics you can post, I need to ask, how many games have you played with the 4 of 5 Cadres you've posted that you intended on using? I'm not attacking you, but to me this does seem a little spammy. On the plus side though, you are bringing out some interesting discussion points with your topics.
The days of goodly English is went

User avatar
Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Posts: 127

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#8 » Aug 03 2017 10:07

A few of these I have played with, but I tend to theorise a lot. At least three of the five I've used. The other two are theories.
To Boldly Go where no Tau has gone before...

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Bloodknife92
Shas'La
Posts: 498

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#9 » Aug 03 2017 11:14

Its never a bad thing to share your ideas with those who share a common interest. Theory is how fact becomes what it is!
The days of goodly English is went

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 2652

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#10 » Aug 03 2017 11:28

Vio'ra Mal'caor wrote:In reply to the comment about razorshaks, the sunshark can only use pulse bombs against ground troops. Razorsharks do not have that limitation for their quad turrets

Yeah but keep in mind that the Razorshark only has 4 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 6+ against non-ground units (BS4+, heavy weapon, targets hard to hit rule) and 2 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 5+ against non-ground units (BS4+, assault weapon, targets hard to hit rule). Without the hard to hit rule it would still only be 4 shots at 5+ and 2 at 4+ against units with the Fly keyword.
It's definitely designed to shoot at ground units as well.

In comparison the Sunshark has 4 S7 AP-1 shots just from the Drones. 8 shots at half range even (15"). Plus 2 S7 AP-1 shots from the same Missile Pod the Razorshark can have plus 2 more if you take an additional Missile Pod.

So vs a real flyer:
Razorshark with MP
4 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 6+
2 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 5+

Sunshark with additional MP
8 (12 at 15") attacks S7 AP-1 hitting on 5+

The Sunshark is cheaper and better against flyer and ground targets. ;)

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Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Posts: 127

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#11 » Aug 04 2017 01:51

Panzer wrote:
Vio'ra Mal'caor wrote:In reply to the comment about razorshaks, the sunshark can only use pulse bombs against ground troops. Razorsharks do not have that limitation for their quad turrets

Yeah but keep in mind that the Razorshark only has 4 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 6+ against non-ground units (BS4+, heavy weapon, targets hard to hit rule) and 2 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 5+ against non-ground units (BS4+, assault weapon, targets hard to hit rule). Without the hard to hit rule it would still only be 4 shots at 5+ and 2 at 4+ against units with the Fly keyword.
It's definitely designed to shoot at ground units as well.

In comparison the Sunshark has 4 S7 AP-1 shots just from the Drones. 8 shots at half range even (15"). Plus 2 S7 AP-1 shots from the same Missile Pod the Razorshark can have plus 2 more if you take an additional Missile Pod.

So vs a real flyer:
Razorshark with MP
4 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 6+
2 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 5+

Sunshark with additional MP
8 (12 at 15") attacks S7 AP-1 hitting on 5+

The Sunshark is cheaper and better against flyer and ground targets. ;)

I know about the razorshark being able to hit ground targets. It is designed for that. Thanks for that Panzer!!!
To Boldly Go where no Tau has gone before...

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 2652

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#12 » Aug 04 2017 01:54

Vio'ra Mal'caor wrote:
Panzer wrote:
Vio'ra Mal'caor wrote:In reply to the comment about razorshaks, the sunshark can only use pulse bombs against ground troops. Razorsharks do not have that limitation for their quad turrets

Yeah but keep in mind that the Razorshark only has 4 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 6+ against non-ground units (BS4+, heavy weapon, targets hard to hit rule) and 2 S7 AP-1 shots hitting on 5+ against non-ground units (BS4+, assault weapon, targets hard to hit rule). Without the hard to hit rule it would still only be 4 shots at 5+ and 2 at 4+ against units with the Fly keyword.
It's definitely designed to shoot at ground units as well.

In comparison the Sunshark has 4 S7 AP-1 shots just from the Drones. 8 shots at half range even (15"). Plus 2 S7 AP-1 shots from the same Missile Pod the Razorshark can have plus 2 more if you take an additional Missile Pod.

So vs a real flyer:
Razorshark with MP
4 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 6+
2 S7 attacks AP-1 hitting on 5+

Sunshark with additional MP
8 (12 at 15") attacks S7 AP-1 hitting on 5+

The Sunshark is cheaper and better against flyer and ground targets. ;)

I know about the razorshark being able to hit ground targets. It is designed for that. Thanks for that Panzer!!!

Not sure if it's because of langauge differences, but the Razorshark being able to hit ground targets was NOT the point I was making!

The point was that the Razorshark is worse than the Sunshark at hitting non-ground targets (which was your argument for taking it over the Sunshark).

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Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Posts: 127

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#13 » Aug 04 2017 02:12

No. I live in Australia. I speak english at home. I did get what you were syaing, I was just noting that when you said 'the razorshark CAN attack ground targets as well', I was saying I knew. Sorry, massive headache. Have to hand in massive assignment tonight.
To Boldly Go where no Tau has gone before...

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 2652

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#14 » Aug 04 2017 02:22

I don't see where I wrote that but okay. :D

Jburli
Shas'La
Posts: 120

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#15 » Aug 04 2017 08:19

Panzer wrote:Okay without even looking or thinking about the details....replace your Razorsharks with Sunsharks. Seriously. :D


Panzer is totally right on this. The sunshark's drone weapons alone are better than razorshark's quad ion turret (especially after the FAQ gave interceptor drones two ion rifles each - for free!).

The bonus mortal wounds from the sun's bombs, particularly against infantry targets, are something the razorshark can't compete with. There's the markerlight too, though that's pretty minor.
If there was a huge price difference I'd understand, but isn't a sunshark only about 6 points more than a razorshark with missile pod?

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Overheal
Shas'Saal
Posts: 176

Re: Fully Airborne Army with Battlesuits

Post#16 » Aug 04 2017 10:23

In addition to those 8/12 shots you get the occasional bomb off, which is up to 10 mortal wounds on Infantry. The Razorshark is very outclassed by the Sunshark.

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