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First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 12 2017 05:36
by Shas'o P'ikle R'ik
Just wanted some advice on my army- if I should change unit sizes, or specifically get rid of a unit in favor of another. I would rather not part with my Devilfish, Longstrike, or the Two Hammerheads. If I need more Pathfinders for Markerlghts, let me know. I have no issue swapping out the Fire Warriors for more Markerlights.
Few questions I need answered--should I keep my infantry squads small as long as the units work in cohesion? Or should I go with larger units with more models?
Here's the list--

HQ--
Longstrike-----191
Fireblade-------42
Fireblade-------42

ELITES--
3-man Crisis Team----234
(2x CIBs ea.)

TROOPS--
8-man Fire Warrior Squad----64 (pulse rifles)
8-man Fire Warrior Squad----64 (pulse rifles)
8-man Fire Warrior Squad----64 (pulse rifles)

FAST ATTACK--
7-unit Drone Squadron-------56 (Gun Drones)
6-man Pathfinder Squad----48 (carbines/ML)
6-man Pathfinder Squad----48 (carbines/ML)
6-man Pathfinder Squad----48 (carbines/ML)

TRANSPORT--
Devilfish/2 Gun Drones----127
Devilfish/2 Gun Drones----127

HEAVY SUPPORT
Railhead/2 Gun Drones----171
Railhead/2 Gun Drones----171

Thanks for the help guys.

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 12 2017 06:57
by Arka0415
Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:Just wanted some advice on my army- if I should change unit sizes, or specifically get rid of a unit in favor of another. I would rather not part with my Devilfish, Longstrike, or the Two Hammerheads. If I need more Pathfinders for Markerlghts, let me know. I have no issue swapping out the Fire Warriors for more Markerlights.
Few questions I need answered--should I keep my infantry squads small as long as the units work in cohesion? Or should I go with larger units with more models?

Hammerheads with Longstrike are a decent group, not amazing but the best long-range firepower we have. Devilfish are good- but only as long as their occupants are Breachers or Gun Drones. If you put Gun Drones in a Devilfish with a Fireblade, it becomes a truly deadly unit. For mechanized units, small squads are best (multiple squads in one transport); for static/gunline units, you can go with larger units. Also, a few things to note- always give XV8s their full complement of Drones and weapons. You're paying 40+ points for the base cost of a suit, so make it count and make the squad as points-efficient as it can be. With that in mind, let's talk about your list!

With Longstrike and two Hammerheads, you're going to want them to work as a group of course. On average, as long as your targets don't have tough invulnerable saves, you should be able to deal 7-8 wounds on vehicles each turn. That's good, but it's not amazing. You might also want to add a Commander armed with Fusion Blasters too, it can deal close-range damage to vehicles which are then finished off by the Hammerhead battery. For a 2000pt list, going with Longstrike plus two Hammerheads is okay, but at 1500 I'd stick to Longstrike and only one Hammerhead. Here's the "core" of the list then, at 1500 points:

HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Smart Missile Systems, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)

Now, let's add some mobile Devilfish units.

HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)

Put eleven Gun Drones plus a Fireblade in each Devilfish. This brings us to 1096, and we still need some Markerlight support and anti-elite units too.

Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 2x Cyclic Ion Blasters (each), 1x ATS (each); 6x Gun Drones (306)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)

Here's the full list at 1500 points.

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HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (201)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters (each); 6x Gun Drones (336)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)

Total: 1504 - Command Points: 5 (2 Outrider Detachments)

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Now, let's say you want to bring this to 2000 points. Let's add another Hammerhead, and improve the Pathfinder units. Let's remove the Pathfinders (-96) and add the following:

Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 8x Markerlights (64)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 3x Rail Rifles, 5x Markerlights (121)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)

This would bring the list to 1774. Still plenty of room to grow! Let's upgrade Longstrike so he's carrying a pair of Smart Missile Systems (+24, as they replace the Gun Drones). Now we're at 1798, with 202 points to spend. So, let's add something to support our Gun Drones.

Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 1x Drone Controller, 1x Shield Generator (103)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 1x Drone Controller, 1x Shield Generator (103)

These guys can be deployed to where you intend to send the Gun Drone units, and can buff their accuracy. Here's the final list:

HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Smart Missile Systems, 2x Seeker Missiles (224)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters (each); 6x Gun Drones (336)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 1x Drone Controller, 1x Shield Generator (103)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 1x Drone Controller, 1x Shield Generator (103)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 8x Markerlights (64)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 3x Rail Rifles, 5x Markerlights (121)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)

Total: 2004 - Command Points: 6 (1 Vanguard Detachment, 2 Outrider Detachments)

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What do you think?

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 12 2017 10:29
by Shas'o P'ikle R'ik
I know gun drones are all the rage, but I really don't like the 18" range on most of our weapons. I want my army to have a layer of fire--Pathfinders mark targets, Hammerheads destroy them, and fire warriors to mop up some remains at 30" and closing.

I read a post by someone on this website that 8 Pathfinders behind cover can take on 400pts worth of Marines.

HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (201)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x XV8s w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters (each); 6x Gun Drones (336)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 5x Gun Drones (40)
Fast Attack - 6x Gun Drones (48)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)
Fast Attack - 6x Pathfinders w/ 6x Markerlights (48)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x Gun Drones (181)

Total: 1504 - Command Points: 5 (2 Outrider Detachments)


I like this list a lot; it's competitive and a really good reflection of how GW wants Mont'ka to look, and I appreciate your time building it. I'll be using it for tournaments.

I want 3 Hammerheads though, and figured I should really take advantage of their synergy with Pathfinders and weapons at the 30" range, and I would take a Crisis Suit Commander but slinging all those points across the board to liquefy a target just to be assaulted next turn leaves me longing for something with better range or more wounds. Hence the upgraded Hammerheads.


HQ--Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2xSeekers = 225pts
HQ--Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight.................. = 42pts
HQ--Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight.................. = 42pts
DEDICATED TRANSPORT-- Devilfish.................. = 127pts
DEDICATED TRANSPORT-- Devilfish.................. = 127pts
ELITES--3-Man Crisis Team w/ 2x Plasma Rifles, ATS ea. accompanied by 4 Gun Drones......................... = 248pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-Drone Gun Drone Squadron. = 40pts
HEAVY SUPPORT-- Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles............................................................... = 205pts
HEAVY SUPPORT-- Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles............................................................... = 205pts

Total: 1501 Points

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 13 2017 07:58
by Arka0415
Sounds like you're really into the tactics side of things! :biggrin: Let's get more advanced then!

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:I know gun drones are all the rage, but I really don't like the 18" range on most of our weapons. I want my army to have a layer of fire--Pathfinders mark targets, Hammerheads destroy them, and fire warriors to mop up some remains at 30" and closing.

Sadly, with the current Index, Tau are looking optimal within the 9"-18" range band. That's not saying we can't play long-range, but many armies out-shoot us at long range with ease. Raven Guard Space Marines, Salamanders Space Marines, Emperor's Children Chaos Space Marines, Adeptus Mechanicus, Astra Militarum... it's a long list sadly.

Also, a few things to mention: Hammerheads aren't going to "destroy" anything. It's good damage, but even three working together can't kill an average tank in one turn of shooting. With three shooting with Longstrike's buff, you're looking at 5/6 chance to hit and usually 2/3 chance to wound, and hopefully the enemy doesn't have armor/cover saves. In general about 50/50 for the damage to go through... and then you roll for damage. Suffice to say, the chance that you can kill a strong enemy tank with all three of your tanks is probably lower than 10%.

For the layer of fire strategy, then, Hammerheads aren't alpha damage- they're "beta" damage if you will. Their range means they can hit all targets on the board, so use them for versatile secondary fire. Pathfinders mark targets, Commanders/XV8s/Stormsurges destroy them, then Hammerheads mop up the remains.

Speaking of mopping up, unless you're truly desperate, Fire Warriors and Hammerheads will never engage the same targets. For the layers of fire against infantry; Pathfinders mark targets, Commanders/XV8s/Drones/Breachers destroy them, Fire Warriors mop up the remains.

In general, aggressively position your short-range guns and engage the targets they can reach first. Once you've fired your short-range guns, use the more versatile long-range guns to finish off damaged vehicles and partial-strength squads.

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:I want 3 Hammerheads though, and figured I should really take advantage of their synergy with Pathfinders and weapons at the 30" range, and I would take a Crisis Suit Commander but slinging all those points across the board to liquefy a target just to be assaulted next turn leaves me longing for something with better range or more wounds. Hence the upgraded Hammerheads.


Using Longstrike/Hammerhead/Pathfinder synergy is a great idea! The maximum wound output of three Hammerheads is 18 (In an extremely rare case, 27) and the average damage is 8-12, at about 600 points. A Fusion Commander gets you possibly 24 (average 8-12) at 160 points. The damage is just incomparable. A Fusion Commander can take down targets that cost more than double its cost. Remember: you aren't positioning it "to liquefy a target just to be assaulted." You're going to destroy a valuable enemy asset, and then your other shooting units will destroy the units threatening that Commander. Use Fire Warriors, Commanders with Missile Pods, Hammerheads, Rail Rifles, etc to clear a path for the Commander. Do this, and you won't have to fear an assault, and you can liquefy another target on turn 2, 3, etc! Force the enemy to respond to you with limited resources and you will win.

If you're bringing 2 Devilfish (20% of your points total!) then those Devilfish need to carry a serious threat. 11 Fire Warriors and a Fireblade; 11 Gun Drones and a Fireblade; 10 Breachers. Pick one and you have a good mechanized unit. Let's ignore the Gun Drone strategy since you like Fire Warriors better, and design a core for a new list:

HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)

That's a solid, fully mechanized core! It's expensive at 1325 points though. With the remaining 175 points, we need to buy some Markerlights at least- two squads of Pathfinders will do nicely. Our goal is to mark 3-5 targets per turn: 1-2 to be engaged by the Hammerheads, 1-2 to be engaged by the Fire Warriors, and 1 to be engaged by the Commander. As such, 10 Markerlights should be enough, since we'll have the Fireblades for redundant Markerlights too.

Fast Attack - 10x Pathfinders (80)

With the remaining 95 points, there's one great unit we can add- Stealthsuits.

Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 3x Multi-Trackers (96)

The Multi-Trackers are just to fill the remaining couple of points. Anyway, here's the triple-Hammerhead list:

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HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 3x Multi-Trackers (96)
Fast Attack - 10x Pathfinders (80)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)

Total: 1501 - Command Points: 4 (1 Patrol Detachment, 1 Supreme Command Detachment)

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What do you think?

By the way, a few things to notice with the other list you made:

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:HQ--Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2xSeekers = 225pts
HQ--Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight.................. = 42pts
HQ--Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight.................. = 42pts
DEDICATED TRANSPORT-- Devilfish.................. = 127pts
DEDICATED TRANSPORT-- Devilfish.................. = 127pts
ELITES--3-Man Crisis Team w/ 2x Plasma Rifles, ATS ea. accompanied by 4 Gun Drones......................... = 248pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
TROOPS-- 5-man Strike Team........................... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-man Pathfinder Team.......... = 40pts
FAST ATTACK-- 5-Drone Gun Drone Squadron. = 40pts
HEAVY SUPPORT-- Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles............................................................... = 205pts
HEAVY SUPPORT-- Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles............................................................... = 205pts


There are a million ways to equip three XV8s, but really there are only a few good loadouts:

- 3x XV8s w/ 9x CIBs; 6x Gun Drones (336)
- 3x XV8s w/ 9x Flamers; 6x Gun Drones (255)
- 3x XV8s w/ 6x Fusion Blasters, 3x Flamers; 6x Gun Drones (327)

Always maximize the number of Drones in the unit (feel free to use Gun or Shield Drones), and only use the ATS on Commanders- it isn't powerful enough to replace the 3rd gun on regular XV8s.

Also, in that list, who will go in the Devilfish?

Tau'va!

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 13 2017 09:20
by Shas'o P'ikle R'ik
With the previous list, the Strike teams/pathfinders would use the Devilfish to keep up with the Hammerheads as well as deploying units to areas on the table with strategic value.
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 3x Multi-Trackers (96)
Fast Attack - 10x Pathfinders (80)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)

:eek: This. *Holds Army List up in the air* This is beautiful. As far as fluff, I am not a fan of XV8s unless it's a Battlesuit army, which seems even more justified in 8e. This list captures what I was going for pretty much to a T. I didn't know if I could get away with not selecting XV8s this edition.

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 13 2017 09:54
by Arka0415
Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:With the previous list, the Strike teams/pathfinders would use the Devilfish to keep up with the Hammerheads as well as deploying units to areas on the table with strategic value.

There's a small problem with that- Pathfinders and Devilfish don't really mix, despite GW calling that an "Optimized Pathfinder Cadre" or whatever. When Pathfinders disembark from a Devilfish, they fire their Markerlights at BS5+, at which point Marker Drones would have been better. If the Pathfinders use their Pulse Carbines, they're just really weak Fire Warriors with same points cost. 3/8 of the Pathfinders' points cost is in Markerlights.

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons, 3x Multi-Trackers (96)
Fast Attack - 10x Pathfinders (80)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)

This. *Holds Army List up in the air* This is beautiful. As far as fluff, I am not a fan of XV8s unless it's a Battlesuit army, which seems even more justified in 8e. This list captures what I was going for pretty much to a T. I didn't know if I could get away with not selecting XV8s this edition

I'm glad you like it! Remember that 11 Fire Warriors + 1 Fireblade go in each Devilfish- Fire Warriors get three shots at 15" range when buffed by the Fireblade. So, 36 S5 shots total including the Fireblade. However, the Devilfish get +4 shots with their Pulse Carbines if they're near the Fireblade too! So once you add the Devilfish's firepower (4 Burst Cannon shots, 12 Pulse Carbine shots) you get a total of 52 S5 shots in the 9"-15" range band! That's enough to absolutely ravage any 10-model squad of infantry short of Primaris Marines.

Anyway, the idea for this list is for the Commander to drop down, the Pathfinders mark targets, the Commander liquefies one target, and the Hammerheads finish it off if it didn't die (or engage other targets if it did). The Fire Warriors and Stealthsuits shoot whatever is dangerous near the Commander. Rinse and repeat.

Though, one thing! Speaking of the fluff, Tau do not field all-Battlesuit armies. On some occasions the Farsight Enclaves do, but those would be small forces. In the fluff, the Tau Empire fields huge numbers of Fire Warriors, Devilfish, Hammerheads, Broadsides, Drones, etc- then, wherever interdiction forces are needed, XV8s drop down as attack units. We tend to see about 3-4 teams of 12 infantry for every team of 3 XV8s. Check out Tau cadre composition here: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Hunter_Cadre

In 8th Edition, you can definitely get away with not fielding XV8s- just use Commanders or mechanized forces instead. I prefer to use XV8s, Commanders, and Fire Warriors in lieu of mechanized forces, but that's just me. You can see my 8th edition army list in my signature if you like.

Anyway, enjoy using that list! :biggrin:

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 13 2017 10:19
by Shas'o P'ikle R'ik
Sticking with the theme of my Army, (Infantry, XV 25s, Hammerheads, Devilish, and limited suit use, if I were to take this up to 2000pts, would a 3rd Hammerhead of the same layout be viable? I forgot where I read it, but I read that with Longstrike's buff, the more Hammerheads the better. (The line of thinking being that if you have Longstrike, use him to 110%.)

So let's say we add another Hammerhead and 5 Pathfinders for additional Markerlights-

5 Pathfinders w/ Markerlights - (40)
Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles -( 205)

And I should take another Crisis Commander, right?

Crisis Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blaster and 2x Shield Drones - (176pts)

Total: 421 (79 points remaining) Possible 10 man gun drone team?

If taking another Hammerhead is a bad enough idea, (like as bad as not flushing,) then what? I'm thinking maybe 2 more squads of Stealthsuits?

Crisis Fusion Commander w/ 2x Shield Drones (176)
5 Pathfinders with Markerlights - (40)
3 XV 25 Suits w/ Burst Cannon (90)
3 XV 25 Suits w/ Burst Cannon (90)
Total: 396 (104 points remaining)

Or what if I could get away without a second Commander?

Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
5 Pathfinders w/ Markerlights (40)
3 XV 25 Suits w/ Burst Cannon (90)
3 XV 25 Suits w/ Burst Cannon (90)
Total: 425 (75 points remaining)

Maybe I should take another 5 Pathfinders? 20 Markerlights for a 2000pt army sounds about right, but I'm a new person.

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 14 2017 07:26
by Arka0415
A 2000pt list? We can do that!

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:Sticking with the theme of my Army, (Infantry, XV 25s, Hammerheads, Devilish, and limited suit use, if I were to take this up to 2000pts, would a 3rd Hammerhead of the same layout be viable? I forgot where I read it, but I read that with Longstrike's buff, the more Hammerheads the better. (The line of thinking being that if you have Longstrike, use him to 110%.)

Hammerheads are good, but they're not amazing. Longstrike + 2 Hammerheads is a good combination, but I wouldn't go any higher than that. We already have a powerful mobile strike force with a few static elements. Let's keep to that theme, and see what we can do!

Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:And I should take another Crisis Commander, right?

You got it! Definitely two Commanders at 2000pts. We can add a second Commander for 176 points, and we can make a more competetive arrangement of Pathfinders too. Let's drop the Pathfinders in their old configuration (10x) and add the following:

HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 5x Markerlights, 3x Rail Rifles (121)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 8x Markerlights (64)

That brings us to 1782, with 216 points left to spend. At this point we have absolutely fantastic anti-tank, good anti-infantry, but what we're really lacking is anti-elite firepower. We can get this from a few different places- Breachers, XV8s with CIBs, XV8s with Plasma Rifles, or Vespid Stingwings. The Breacher route is great, as it gives you another Devilfish to use! Let's add it in too.

Troops - 10x Breachers (80)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)

There's 11 points remaining after this, so here are a few changes: drop the Multi-Trackers from the Stealthsuits (-6), and give each Devilfish a Seeker Missile (+15). Seeker Missiles aren't too good on Devilfish, since they hit on BS4+ (not BS2+ like a Longstrike-buffed Hammerhead) But there's not much we can do with those remaining points anyway. Here's the list:

HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 10x Breachers (80)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons (90)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 5x Markerlights, 3x Rail Rifles (121)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 8x Markerlights (64)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)

Total: 1998 - Command Points: 7 (1 Battalion Detachment, 1 Supreme Command Detachment)

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What do you think?

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 15 2017 09:46
by Yojimbob
In my opinion, drop the second fireblade since they are both hiding in fish anyway and run both fish with strike teams together with the third fish by itself with darkstrider in it. Enhances the punch breachers bring while also allowing them to run from CC IF they manage to survive the assault. Bonus points for running all three squads together so that darkstrider can pull every squad from combat. Just my food for thought.

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 15 2017 08:34
by Shas'o P'ikle R'ik
In my opinion, drop the second fireblade since they are both hiding in fish anyway and run both fish with strike teams


52 S5 D1 Shots at 15" is too good to pass up, the second Fireblade allows for two different deployed forces to keep flexibility and mobility. Im keeping the Fireblade.


HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 11x Fire Warriors (88)
Troops - 10x Breachers (80)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon, 1x Seeker Missile; 2x Gun Drones (132)
Elites - 3x Stealthsuits w/ 3x Burst Cannons (90)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 5x Markerlights, 3x Rail Rifles (121)
Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders w/ 8x Markerlights (64)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead w/ Railgun, 2x SMS, 2x Seeker Missiles (205)


I like this list, but I don't think I should buy any more ST5 AP0 D1 weapons when I have fire warriors, so I dropped the stealthsuit's (12 shots for 90pts...) And picked up two more breachers so I now have 2 squads of 6. I think I need something with enough power to keep heavier units (specifically those hideous Primaris Dreadnoughts) at bay, so I took the Pathfinders and shuffled them around. PAC drones are a little bit of a gamble, but for spending the last 16 points on expanding my FW range by 6", I'm willing to take the risk. I took 3 more Railfinders and dropped 1 normal Pathfinder, then evened up the squads so I don't lose any Railfinders to morale tests by keeping my eggs in a few different baskets. I also took the seeker missiles off the devilfish in order to save points for the rail rifles. Yes, the seekers are more cost effective than Rail Rifles, but if I play my cards right I would be able to use my Railfinders more than I could attack with seeker missiles. Anywho, the result is this:



HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Smart Missile Systems, 2x Seeker Missiles (224)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters, 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight, (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Troops - 5x Fire Warriors (40)
Troops - 5x Fire Warriors (40)
Troops - 6x Fire Warriors (48)
Troops - 6x Fire Warriors (48)
Troops - 6x Breachers (40)
Troops - 6x Breachers (40)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x SMS (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x SMS (205)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, 1x PAC Drone (94)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, 1x PAC Drone (94)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, (86)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
(Outrider Detachment) (+1 Command Point)
Longstrike, 2x Hammerheads, 3x Pathfinder Squads (HQ, HS, HS, FA, FA,FA)
(2x Battallion Detachment) (+6 Command Points)
Battlesuit Commander, Fireblade, Breacher Team, 2 Strike Teams. (HQ, HQ, TR, TR, TR)

GRAND TOTAL: 1997 POINTS
10 COMMAND POINTS (2X Battalion Detachments, 1X Outrider Detachment)

I want to see how well this works. Arka, I can't thank you enough for helping me boil this list down from a total fluff fest to an army that can hold it's own. Jimbo, I'm glad you dropped in to weigh in ( I spent 3 hours deliberating over darkstrider, didn't end up taking him because of my Rail Rifles.)

Guess all I have to do now is assemble, paint, and post. :D

Re: First 40k Army List Ever

Posted: Sep 16 2017 06:56
by Arka0415
Shas'o P'ikle R'ik wrote:HQ - Longstrike w/ Railgun, 2x Smart Missile Systems, 2x Seeker Missiles (225)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters, 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
HQ - Cadre Fireblade w/ Markerlight (42)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Dedicated Transport - Devilfish w/ Burst Cannon; 2x Gun Drones (127)
Troops - 5x Fire Warriors (40)
Troops - 5x Fire Warriors (40)
Troops - 6x Fire Warriors (48)
Troops - 6x Fire Warriors (48)
Troops - 6x Breachers (48)
Troops - 6x Breachers (48)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x SMS (205)
Heavy Support - Hammerhead Gunship w/ Railgun, 2x Seeker Missiles; 2x SMS (205)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, 1x PAC Drone (94)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, 1x PAC Drone (94)
Fast Attack - 4x Pathfinders w/ Markerlights, 2x Pathfinders w/ Rail Rifles, (86)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
(Outrider Detachment) (+1 Command Point)
Longstrike, 2x Hammerheads, 3x Pathfinder Squads (HQ, HS, HS, FA, FA,FA)
(2x Battallion Detachment) (+6 Command Points)
Battlesuit Commander, Fireblade, Breacher Team, 2 Strike Teams. (HQ, HQ, TR, TR, TR)

GRAND TOTAL: 1998 POINTS
10 COMMAND POINTS (2X Battalion Detachments, 1X Outrider Detachment)


This is a solid list- just fixed a few points typos for you in yellow in the quote there. I like the double Breacher teams in the Devilfish as a way to get around the 5-10 requirement for Breachers. About the Pathfinders though- the PAC Drones aren't going to do anything sadly. They're one-wound units that will die quickly and give up First Blood quickly, and offer no benefit to neither Rail Rifles nor Markerlights. Drop those two Drones and you get 18 points to spend. With these points we can put three Seeker Missiles back on the three Devilfish (+15) or give each of the six Fire Warriors Shas'ui a Markerlight (+18).