2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

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Quorgyle
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2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#1 » Oct 17 2017 01:22

I've been reading, watching and experimenting a lot. This is, I believe, the current meta list. Main goal is to win tournaments. It's complete cheese and spam. List is open for discussion of course.

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT

-HQ-
Commander, 3x Missile Pod, 1x Drone Controller
Commander, 3x Missile Pod, 1x Drone Controller

-Fast Attack-
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone, 1x Marker Drone
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone, 1x Marker Drone
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone, 1x Marker Drone
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone, 1x Marker Drone
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone, 1x Marker Drone
5x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone


SUPREME COMMAND DETACHMENT

-HQ-
Commander, 4x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone
Commander, 4x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone
Commander, 4x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone
Commander, 4x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone
Commander, 4x Missile Pod


VANGUARD DETACHMENT

-HQ-
Commander, 4x Fusion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone
Commander, 4x Fusion Blaster, 2x Shield Drone

-Elites-
Firesight Marksman
Firesight Marksman
Firesight Marksman

-Fast Attack-
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone
4x Gun Drone, 2x Shield Drone

Total: 2000 points

You can ignore tactical objectives with this list pretty much and just go full agressive on tabling the opponent.
I believe we can expect changes when the Codex comes out, but I wanted to post a list like this for people that are lazy to research on their own or just want to win a tournament. :D

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Glarblar
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#2 » Oct 17 2017 01:29

I'm curious what the judgement behind the Drone squad loadouts is?

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Quorgyle
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#3 » Oct 17 2017 01:42

Well Gun Drones for the pew pew, Shield Drones for the 4+ invulnerable save and 5+ FNP, 1 Marker Drone for 1 marker light. It's much easier if you have 1 Marker Drone per unit instead of a whole unit of Marker Drones, you don't have to split the fire, so if you miss with the marker, you can still use another Marker Drone from another unit to mark a prio target.

If your Drone unit get's shot at, getting those Shield Drone saves helps very much. Small units because of moral.

EDIT:
Yesterday I've played a similar list (with no Shield Drones in the Drone units) against my friend who played Ultramarines. He's very experienced and had a strong shooty list, not very cheesy but still decent strong. I didn't have as many Drones as the list above, and he seized me. 80% of the Drones were gone in his first turn. Yesterday, he got tabled the first time since he started playing 40k. If I had Shield Drones in those Drone units, he would have lost even sooner.

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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#4 » Oct 17 2017 03:37

Maybe going ATSs on the CIB suits - also freeing up some points?

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Quorgyle
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Posts: 61

Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#5 » Oct 17 2017 04:04

I believe (and we had that discussion on another topic on this forum) that going with more shots is overall better because ATS is slightly better only in some cases. More weapons give more flexibility (my opinion). For example, you gonna face a Chaos Daemon list with tons of Horrors and army wide invulnerable saves, ATS in that case is a complete waste of points.

Another thing that you can change in the list, remove the Vanguard Detachment and add a Battalion Detachment. This way you can add another Commander to the list but you "loose" points on the Troops choice (24 points for the Firesight Marksman versus 40 points for a Strike Team per unit). That way you would also need to drop a significant amount of Drones. 9 Commanders in this list are already very tough and adding a 10th Commander might not be necessary. In my game yesterday for example, the Ultramarine player barely killed 2 Commanders which had the Drone Controllers, 8 stayed alive till the end (I went with the Battalion choice in that list + Coldstar Commander Warlord which is not worth it compared to 4x weapon Commander imo). Allocating wounds to nearby Shield Drones is a huge advantage.
So, if anyone wondered why I took the Vanguard Detachment...it allows you to take 2 more Commanders with a minimum point waste on 3 elite choices, in this case 24 points for the Firesight Marksman per unit.

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Juicy Fruit
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#6 » Oct 17 2017 05:35

Quorgyle wrote:So, if anyone wondered why I took the Vanguard Detachment...it allows you to take 2 more Commanders with a minimum point waste on 3 elite choices, in this case 24 points for the Firesight Marksman per unit.


Does the tournament you want to enter have a rule that prevents you from taking two of the same detachment? Another outrider would waste 0 points.

It's lists like this and the smurf version of guilliman + assault cannon razorbacks that will keep me clear of competitive gaming :D I'd be very interested to see how you get on though. Best of luck & keep us updated!
Primum conatus pessimi

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Quorgyle
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#7 » Oct 17 2017 06:20

A lot of tournaments follow ETC rules or have very similar rules. For example, max 3 detachments, no detachment duplicating, no Forgeworld, no understrenght units and so on.
But you are right, if there is no rule for detachment duplicating, you could go all out and take just Commanders and Drones. :evil:

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Arka0415
Shas'Ui
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#8 » Oct 17 2017 07:04

If you want this as a tournament list, you should make everything as uniform as you can to mess with enemy target priority, and get everything into that 18" maximum firepower sweet spot. Also, we only need land a couple of Markerlight hits per turn so we probably don't need as many Markerlights. We can also dispense with Drone Controllers as our Drones seem capable on their own. Here's what I'd do:

-

HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 4x Fusion Blasters; 2x Shield Drones (176)
HQ - Commander w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, ATS; 2x Shield Drones (154)
HQ - Commander w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, ATS; 2x Shield Drones (154)
HQ - Commander w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, ATS; 2x Shield Drones (154)
HQ - Commander w/ 3x Cyclic Ion Blasters, ATS; 2x Shield Drones (154)
HQ - Commander w/ 3x Missile Pods, ATS (156)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)
Fast Attack - 4x Gun Drones, 2x Shield Drones, 1x Marker Drone (58)

Total: 1998 - Command Points: 6 (1 Supreme Command Detachment, 2 Outrider Detachments)

-

Enjoy fighting that! :P

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You_Father_Sky
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#9 » Oct 18 2017 04:14

My current competive list is:

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 1
HQ
Shas'O R'alai

Elite
X2 Technical Drones
X2 Technical Drones

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Shield Drones

XV109 Y'Vahra
ATS, Target Lock, x2 Shielded Missile Drones

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 2
HQ
Cadre Fireblade

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone

SUPREME COMMAND DETACHMENT
Commander 1: 3 Burst Cannons, ATS, 2 Marker Drones
Commander 2: 3 Fusion, D-Controller, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 3: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 4: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 5: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones

115PL - 2000PTS - 6CP
"For the glory of Kauyon, of course!"

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Emberkahn
Shas'Saal
Posts: 116

Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#10 » Oct 19 2017 04:39

You_Father_Sky wrote:My current competive list is:

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 1
HQ
Shas'O R'alai

Elite
X2 Technical Drones
X2 Technical Drones

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Shield Drones

XV109 Y'Vahra
ATS, Target Lock, x2 Shielded Missile Drones

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 2
HQ
Cadre Fireblade

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone

SUPREME COMMAND DETACHMENT
Commander 1: 3 Burst Cannons, ATS, 2 Marker Drones
Commander 2: 3 Fusion, D-Controller, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 3: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 4: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 5: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones

115PL - 2000PTS - 6CP


I know you have gone quite a drone heavy list, but how do you find R'alai?

Has he been effective? I always tended to look past him as being an overly expensive ineffective DC. What has your experience been?

Edit: Done some math. Looks fun. Definitely taking him next list to back up drone horde

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You_Father_Sky
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#11 » Nov 10 2017 01:23

Emberkahn wrote:
You_Father_Sky wrote:My current competive list is:

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 1
HQ
Shas'O R'alai

Elite
X2 Technical Drones
X2 Technical Drones

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Shield Drones

XV109 Y'Vahra
ATS, Target Lock, x2 Shielded Missile Drones

OUTRIDER DETACHMENT 2
HQ
Cadre Fireblade

Fast Attack
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone
X4 Gun Drones x1 Marker Drone

SUPREME COMMAND DETACHMENT
Commander 1: 3 Burst Cannons, ATS, 2 Marker Drones
Commander 2: 3 Fusion, D-Controller, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 3: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 4: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones
Commander 5: 4 Fusion Blasters, 2 Gun Drones

115PL - 2000PTS - 6CP


I know you have gone quite a drone heavy list, but how do you find R'alai?

Has he been effective? I always tended to look past him as being an overly expensive ineffective DC. What has your experience been?

Edit: Done some math. Looks fun. Definitely taking him next list to back up drone horde


R'alai keeps getting overlooked because people are looking for their HQ units to be flashy and jump off the page for them. Either crazy psychic powers or the ability to melt tanks etc. People want their HQs to BE a terror, rather than support a terror or to be PART of a terror.

For me, he has been incredible, and I find him to be one of the coolest looking, and most stacked HQ options we have.

For 155pts: He has T6, 8 Wounds, a 3+/4+Invul, a built in drone controller, 2 special low silhouette marker drones, photon casters, jetpacks, manta strike ability, a BRILLIANT weapon that can chink wounds off of anything, and coupled with his assassin rule, makes him great at crippling or finishing off characters.

Definitely take him! He is THE perfect support HQ, and if you want a drone controller, while stealth suits, and hazards, and keels etc, can all do it will enough, he is DESIGNED for it. I think you'll have a lot of fun with him!

(PS: I have loved drones since I started Tau in 3rd edition, they're great little dudes and the fluff for them is great!
When I left in 4th ed, and came back in 7th I found them to be stellar in the drone net and now in 8th they've stayed great. They have been exceptional for me as well, and my list is currently undefeated in my local area)
"For the glory of Kauyon, of course!"

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Emberkahn
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#12 » Nov 10 2017 02:36

You_Father_Sky wrote:
R'alai keeps getting overlooked because people are looking for their HQ units to be flashy and jump off the page for them. Either crazy psychic powers or the ability to melt tanks etc. People want their HQs to BE a terror, rather than support a terror or to be PART of a terror.

For me, he has been incredible, and I find him to be one of the coolest looking, and most stacked HQ options we have.

For 155pts: He has T6, 8 Wounds, a 3+/4+Invul, a built in drone controller, 2 special low silhouette marker drones, photon casters, jetpacks, manta strike ability, a BRILLIANT weapon that can chink wounds off of anything, and coupled with his assassin rule, makes him great at crippling or finishing off characters.

Definitely take him! He is THE perfect support HQ, and if you want a drone controller, while stealth suits, and hazards, and keels etc, can all do it will enough, he is DESIGNED for it. I think you'll have a lot of fun with him!

(PS: I have loved drones since I started Tau in 3rd edition, they're great little dudes and the fluff for them is great!
When I left in 4th ed, and came back in 7th I found them to be stellar in the drone net and now in 8th they've stayed great. They have been exceptional for me as well, and my list is currently undefeated in my local area)


Yeah in the time it took you to reply to this post I started taking him heaps and I have to agree.

However, his gun isn't really that good. Will take a couple of wounds of a russ here and there, but it's not really that amazing.

Mostly I just put him at the front of my commander blobs to provide a DC and an 8 wound T6 3++ barrier before they can touch my QFCs. He is cheap too!

Ultimately he is solid to take in a list because I love his style, but he's not so strong to propel him to the level of QFCs. Quite balanced. If a QFC is a 9.5 and a crisis suit (without flamers) is a 4/5, he is probably a 7.5.

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Arka0415
Shas'Ui
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#13 » Nov 10 2017 03:12

Emberkahn wrote:However, his gun isn't really that good. Will take a couple of wounds of a russ here and there, but it's not really that amazing.

This is the problem with R'alai. Tau currently do not have access to amazing firepower- we need to spam multiple of the same gun to have any effect. Commanders are only good because they have BS2+ and can take several of the same weapon- R'alai is basically a pile of upgrades and wargear that just aren't useful. His special Marker Drones are no different from ordinary ones and can't be replaced with Shield Drones, his BS2+ is wasted by having one gun, two systems, and an empty 4th slot, his "Assassin" special rule and special Shield Generator offer no real benefit.

For 155 points what are you getting? A durable character whose weapon is essentially two neutered Plasma Rifles? Sure, he's surprisingly durable, but that's his only redeeming feature.

Personally, I just don't see it.

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You_Father_Sky
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#14 » Nov 10 2017 05:07

His gun is solid! Assault 2, STR 9 AP -2, 2 dam. The hard stats are fantastic, it just puts out a steady, reliable bit of damage (4) as opposed to D6, or 4D6 in the case of the fusion commander. Again, he's a stacked all rounder, not a tank killer.

I'd always take my QFCs in a supreme command drop anyway.
"For the glory of Kauyon, of course!"

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Beerson
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#15 » Nov 10 2017 05:10

Arka0415 wrote:This is the problem with R'alai. Tau currently do not have access to amazing firepower- we need to spam multiple of the same gun to have any effect. Commanders are only good because they have BS2+ and can take several of the same weapon- R'alai is basically a pile of upgrades and wargear that just aren't useful. His special Marker Drones are no different from ordinary ones and can't be replaced with Shield Drones, his BS2+ is wasted by having one gun, two systems, and an empty 4th slot, his "Assassin" special rule and special Shield Generator offer no real benefit.

For 155 points what are you getting? A durable character whose weapon is essentially two neutered Plasma Rifles? Sure, he's surprisingly durable, but that's his only redeeming feature.

Personally, I just don't see it.


thanks Arka for the voice of reason, reading through this topic I got the feeling that I need to take him, and have been bugging my mind about how am I going to fix his terrible sculpt to look Tau, now I can just go back to molding FB's :)

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You_Father_Sky
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#16 » Nov 10 2017 05:10

A neutered plasma rifle?

Plasma is STR 6 ap -3, rapid fire, his is assault, and stronger, and does multi damage, he's designed to stay on the move and peg stuff from a distance. Again, you're looking at it from a pure damage point of view. You take him as a drone controller because it frees up your elite slots for much more flexible choices.

If you're going to use him for the synergy he has with drones and lighting stuff, great, if you're not going to play a drone heavy list, don't bother taking him. Unless you want to run a XV9 Hazard drop, so you can smoke characters, but again, fusion commanders work plenty well for that.
"For the glory of Kauyon, of course!"

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Arka0415
Shas'Ui
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Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#17 » Nov 10 2017 07:06

You_Father_Sky wrote:A neutered plasma rifle?

Plasma is STR 6 ap -3, rapid fire, his is assault, and stronger, and does multi damage, he's designed to stay on the move and peg stuff from a distance. Again, you're looking at it from a pure damage point of view. You take him as a drone controller because it frees up your elite slots for much more flexible choices.

I mean the EMP profile. It's basically identical to a pair of weak Plasma Rifles- 24" range, Rapid Fire, S6. The S9 option is pretty cool, it's got a solid chance to get 1 wound through but 2 is unlikely. So, we have 158 points (Base cost + 2x Blacklight Marker Drones + 2x Markerlights, right?) for a few points of damage per turn and a Drone Controller.

I admit that the experimental gun is cool on the S9 profile. However, I feel like he's drastically overcosted seeing as most of his abilities- Shield Generator, extra Toughness, extra Wounds, Photon Casters, and the "Assassin" ability will almost never come into play.

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Emberkahn
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Posts: 116

Re: 2000 pts highly competitive/perfect Tau list

Post#18 » Nov 10 2017 07:37

Arka0415 wrote:
Emberkahn wrote:However, his gun isn't really that good. Will take a couple of wounds of a russ here and there, but it's not really that amazing.

This is the problem with R'alai. Tau currently do not have access to amazing firepower- we need to spam multiple of the same gun to have any effect. Commanders are only good because they have BS2+ and can take several of the same weapon- R'alai is basically a pile of upgrades and wargear that just aren't useful. His special Marker Drones are no different from ordinary ones and can't be replaced with Shield Drones, his BS2+ is wasted by having one gun, two systems, and an empty 4th slot, his "Assassin" special rule and special Shield Generator offer no real benefit.

For 155 points what are you getting? A durable character whose weapon is essentially two neutered Plasma Rifles? Sure, he's surprisingly durable, but that's his only redeeming feature.

Personally, I just don't see it.


His drones are AMAZING!!! Why? BECAUSE THEY ARE FRCKIN NINJAS!!! WS3+!!!! In all seriousness though I do love this part of their rules.

On a slightly different note, if you are taking almost pure commander lists, as I often do, one of the problems you face is how to keep them alive. The most effective way of doing this is by putting tough stuff directly in front of them.

Usually I use Tiger Sharks because those things are nigh on invincible. But, given we recently banned flyers in my gaming group I have been using R'alai. Dropping a T6 W8 3+ Inv in front of your commanders I find to be incredibly useful; he is exceptionally hard to kill. It's not just his toughness, as mentioned above. It's his flexibility; being able to drop with the commanders to body block. This is in practice more useful than it seems on paper.

It's also worth being aware that his gun has a 36" range, a rare find in our codex these days.

All these things combined I feel make him useable; my opponent generally underestimates him so he has done some reasonable work. I mean, he might not quite have the offensive power of a commander, but he will survive for 3x as long, allowing him to effectively do the same damage that a QFC does over its lifespan of 2 turns, whilst simultaneously bodyblocking for everyone and having some minor drone support utility.
Last edited by Emberkahn on Nov 10 2017 08:09, edited 1 time in total.

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