Themed Orca List

Discuss and develop your army list amongst new players and veterans alike.
User avatar
T0nkaTruckDriver
Shas'O
Shas'O
Posts: 1701

Themed Orca List

Post#1 » Jan 26 2018 10:46

A while ago I had an idea to build a 1500(ish) point list for narritive games consisting of nothing but a few infiltrators and an Orca full of dudes. The idea was that a Stealth team would be inserted to locate and identify a high profile target, and then the Orca would be called in to take it out.

Now fast forward 7 years I just dug out my minis from storage and am picking this back up. There's still a ways to go on the modeling side, but a recent trip to the local gaming store has me reeling on how much the game itself has changed since I've last played! I've downloaded the core ruleset and gotten my hands on our interim army index. I've even found the most recent IA listing for the Orca. BattleScribe is pretty rad too. While this army will almost entirely be used for fun/narritive play, I'd love some help from some of you more experienced folks building a list that is at least fun and somewhat effective if not optimal, given the general constraints I've described above.

For the Orca to make sense, I like the idea of including a lot of units which otherwise wouldn't have the ability to Deep Strike (Manta Strike for you youngins). Broadsides, Strike Teams, Pathfinders, etc. I'm disappointed that the most recent Orca rules don't technically allow Commanders or Broadsides to be transported, although I've chatted with my gaming group about allowing it since this is for fun/narritive play. So for the purposes of this list building exercise, let's assume any "standard" size XV series battlesuits are fine in the Orca including all Crisis and Broadside variants. Excepting of course the big guys like the Riptide, Stormsuge, Ghostkeel, etc.

Here's a sample list I put together as a starting point:

Commander Shadowsun (195)
- [Command Link Drone, 2x Shield Drones]

Notes: She's my stand-in for a "prepositioned Stealth team" and will be the only unit starting on the table. I considered using a standard XV25 squad for this purpose, but I already have so many other S5 shots in the list, more Burst Cannons just seemed unnecessary (and adding Fusion to Stealths Suits still seems like a bad idea). Shadowsun's 2x Fusion Blasters at BS 2+ will add a good bit of anti-tank to the list on top of her Command Drone perks and super duper Shield Drones. Plus I love the model :)

Cadre Fireblade (42)
- [Pulse Rifle, Markerlight]

Notes: A cheap HQ choice that makes a lot of sense in a list with beaucoups Pulse weapons.

Commander (137)
- [2x Missile Pod, ATS, DC]

Notes: Missile Pods got expensive! That said, my one Crisis Suit has to fill the gap between Railgun and Pulse weaponry ... and Missile Pods still seem like the best option for that. The ATS seems very complimentary with the Missile Pod, and a DC seems good with all the Gun Drones in the list.

6 Firewarriors w/ Pulse Rifles (51)
- [Shas'Ui, Markerlight]
6 Firewarriors w/ Pulse Rifles (51)
- [Shas'Ui, Markerlight]
6 Firewarriors w/ Pulse Rifles (51)
- [Shas'Ui, Markerlight]

Notes: I really wanted to run these guys with Carbines, but the new rules for Rapid Fire weapons seem to have given Rifles a really nice bump. Also, Gun Drones just seem like a much better platform for Carbines. So min size rifle squads with a Markerlight for utility. Would Breachers be better here?

8 Gun Drones (64)
8 Gun Drones (64)
8 Pathfinders (80)
- [Shas'Ui, Pulse Accelerator Drone]

Notes: The backbone of my mobile infantry. The Fireblade and Commander will hang with these guys with the Firewarriors in support. How do the Fireblade and Pulse Accelerator interract, do Pulse Rifles get 3 shots at 18" if under both effects? Gun Drones seem in a really good spot. I'd love to have a few more Drone Controllers sprinkled around; I wish the Firewarrior/Pathfinder Shas'Ui could bring them ...

2 XV-88 Broadside Battlesuits (378)
- Shas'Vre [Rail Rifle, 2x SMS, Target Lock]
- Shas'Ui [Rail Rifle, 2x SMS, Target Lock]

Notes: Broadsides seem overcosted right now, but they fit the theme and I want to use them ... so here they are. Target locks seem like the best use of their wargear slot.

Orca (373)
- [2x LB Burst Cannons, Missile Pod]


Total: 1486


I've got a game against IG set up for Monday at 1600 points - so I'd love some feedback on the list as presented as well as thoughts on what might be good to add with the additional points. Models I have available include 6 Stealths, 1 Crisis, 6 Vespid, some on-foot Shas'La (that could be Firewarriors or Pathfinders), and a Barracuda all of which I'd feel good about including with the theme. I'd love to toss in a few Shield Drones to hang out near the Broadsides as well (thoughts on quantity?). Are Seekers good in the new rules/metagame? The Orca can't take them, but I could put a couple on the Broadsides (or the Barracuda if it makes it in); I'd thought they might make sense given the amount of Markerlight support in the list. The Orca has 11 transport slots remaining (Crisis take 2 slots and Broadsides take 4 slots). I also have a Hammerhead (with Ion/Rail/Fusion turret options) and a Devilfish, although I don't feel great about including either of these from a thematic perspective ... but could be convinced if there was a strong argument for them.

Thanks for reading!

User avatar
SniperTau
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 227

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#2 » Jan 27 2018 05:05

With the models you have, I’d say split the drones into squads of four for morale, and add in the vespid and another fire warrior squad(btw, min size is five in 8e). That’s about all, although against ig you have a lack of antitank. Perhaps change the missile commander to a 4x fusion commander.


Tau’va,

Sniper

User avatar
T0nkaTruckDriver
Shas'O
Shas'O
Posts: 1701

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#3 » Feb 04 2018 08:42

Image


The game happened! I won, but learned later that I misplayed Savior Protocols to my (significant) advantage. My opponent is also an awesome person and I think he went easy on me :smile:

Some takeaways from this game and 8th ed in general:

GW has really gone overboard with the special rules. I couldn't keep straight which of my special rules applied to which subset of models or weapons. Pulse Accelerator only applies to infantry. Recon Drone only applies to Pathfinders. Fireblade only applies to Pulse Weapons (but not Burst Cannons). Are Vespid <SEPT> units? Ugh ... And don't get me started on all the different ways to reroll things! I'm sure I'll get it straight eventually, I was just struck by how complicated it all was. The flip side of this of course is that there are no "normal" units anymore and so it's impossible to have a sense of what a unit is capable of just by looking at it, because you have no idea what special rules are buffing it at any given time.

I realize Broadsides are probably overcosted ... but they really performed well. It helped that they were in cover and had amazing fire lanes the whole game on account of the Orca dropping them on top of a tower, but they put out solid, consistent damage, soaked a ton of fire, and looked badass doing it. I was happy with the Target Locks as their support system. 30" dual SMS is a nice buff too.

Shadowsun was fun, but I don't think I used her well. I always forgot about her Command Link Drone, and never declared Kau'yon or Mont'ka (let alone twice), so I suspect I'll need to run her a few more times to really get a sense for how she should be played in this edition. She deployed forward and jumped into half range on turn 2 for a couple juicy melta shots on a Leman Russ. The tank didn't die and she was charged by a melee command squad with power weapons, buffed with a pair of psykers. I thought she was toast, but then realized she's -1 to hit in melee, T4, and has a 5+ INV save ... on top of her 5 wounds. So she survived, hopped out of combat, and flew up to the Orca (which had just dropped off the army and was now empty) to let the firing line which had just deployed behind her do their job. Later she got dropped off again behind the tank line and put some melta love onto another Russ from behind (with the nearby empty Orca guaranteeing she wouldn't be targetable).

Gun Drones and Firewarriors roll a lot of dice. It was fun rolling 64 dice for 2 squads of Gun Drones ... but they barely killed a unit of Stormtroopers. Again with the special rules, orders, cover, etc.

I appreciate that cover is now just a modifier to armor save. It gives Space Marines a reason to care about terrain, which I appreciate. It does however make things like Kroot or basic Guardsmen a lot less durable. It also makes weapons with AP bonuses really valuable!

Deep Strike is obviously super powerful now. I miss the calculated risk/reward thought process that came from trying to decide whether to drop a Fusion monat behind a tank. And the sense of elation when he stuck the landing and turns it to slag :evil: Now with the risk gone and so many units able to deep strike, it seems like a big part of the game is figuring out ways to use expendible units to deny deep strike zones.


That's all for now, hopefully I'll get in another game this week :biggrin:

User avatar
Arka0415
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 3168

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#4 » Feb 04 2018 09:03

Sounds like a fun game! And that Orca is a mighty presence on the tabletop. Is it the real thing?

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:GW has really gone overboard with the special rules. I couldn't keep straight which of my special rules applied to which subset of models or weapons. Pulse Accelerator only applies to infantry. Recon Drone only applies to Pathfinders. Fireblade only applies to Pulse Weapons (but not Burst Cannons). Are Vespid <SEPT> units? Ugh ... And don't get me started on all the different ways to reroll things!

There definitely are a lot of rules now! Less than in 7th Edition, but still lots. For things like Pulse Accelerators and Recon Drones, it may be best to just memorize what they can buff, since these are all "whitelist" abilities.

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:I realize Broadsides are probably overcosted ... but they really performed well. It helped that they were in cover and had amazing fire lanes the whole game on account of the Orca dropping them on top of a tower, but they put out solid, consistent damage, soaked a ton of fire, and looked badass doing it. I was happy with the Target Locks as their support system. 30" dual SMS is a nice buff too.

Broadsides can be effective, definitely. Their design features- big guns and long range on a small chassis- are great. It's just that 180+ points cost... :?

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:I appreciate that cover is now just a modifier to armor save. It gives Space Marines a reason to care about terrain, which I appreciate. It does however make things like Kroot or basic Guardsmen a lot less durable. It also makes weapons with AP bonuses really valuable!

Seeing as Kroot go to Sv5+ and Guardsmen go to Sv4+, and neither are as easily wounded on 2+ anymore, light infantry may like being in cover even more now. What made light infantry feel less durable to you?

User avatar
T0nkaTruckDriver
Shas'O
Shas'O
Posts: 1701

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#5 » Feb 05 2018 01:56

Arka0415 wrote:Sounds like a fun game! And that Orca is a mighty presence on the tabletop. Is it the real thing?


Yeah! I bought it in 2009 and took a break from the hobby shortly after. It's been half finished in storage since then :-? I started a project log way back then and am hoping to pick up where I left off once I get my hobby table set up again.



Arka0415 wrote:What made light infantry feel less durable to you?


Yeah, I see what you're saying. The last time I played 40K with any regularity was in 5th ed where Kroot in woods got effectively a 4+ INV save, which made them super durable against just about any kind of shooting (excepting flamers). Now they get a 5+ armor save which can be negated by any weapon with an AP modifier. I was facing Stormtroopers with Hellguns, so light and medium infantry were all pretty fragile.

User avatar
SniperTau
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 227

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#6 » Feb 05 2018 02:05

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:I was facing Stormtroopers with Hellguns, so light and medium infantry were all pretty fragile.


Scions(the new name for stormtroopers) are great this edition(I should know, my friends literally flinch when I put a plasma command squad on the table :D ) But they are expensive, with even their basic hellgun costing 1pt. And they are rather flimsy to heavy bolter fire and the like, as they are only T3 Sv4+.

I love the Orca. It is a real shame that they discontinued it, I really hope it comes back someday.

What regiment did he play? He obviously had some Scions, but what was his main one?

User avatar
Arka0415
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 3168

Re: Themed Orca List

Post#7 » Feb 05 2018 02:26

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:What made light infantry feel less durable to you?


Yeah, I see what you're saying. The last time I played 40K with any regularity was in 5th ed where Kroot in woods got effectively a 4+ INV save, which made them super durable against just about any kind of shooting (excepting flamers). Now they get a 5+ armor save which can be negated by any weapon with an AP modifier. I was facing Stormtroopers with Hellguns, so light and medium infantry were all pretty fragile.

Right, I remember that now. I was thinking about 6th (?) when cover was 5+. Compared against previous editions, we can see something interesting with mid-strength weapons:

Heavy Bolter vs. Kroot in cover (10 shots):
5th Edition: 2.7 kills
6th Edition: 3.7 kills
8th Edition: 3.7 kills

Many weapons wound Kroot on 3+ when they previously wounded on 2+, making Kroot a bit more durable even though many of these weapons now have AP-1, so it balances out! The real winners though are the low-strength high-AP guns which can really rip through cover now.

Return to “Cadre Building”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest