How to Post an Army List

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T0nkaTruckDriver
Shas'O
Posts: 1678

How to Post an Army List

Post#1 » Oct 25 2007 09:03

New members to ATT are frequently frustrated when posting an army list for the first time. Even after reading through the Member Guidelines and Stickes in each forum, it can still be difficult to understand exactly what is expected when posting on ATT. Therefore, this thread is an attempt to show examples of what to do and what not to do when posting an army list on ATT.

The following was sent to me via PM by a conscientious member who was curious if his proposed post was "up to ATT standards"; wanting to be sure before posting it on the forum. I've gotten his/her approval to post it here for the education of all. I hope it is received with the intended mind; namely that of constructive criticism with the aim of benefiting the community.

Before we get started, everyone should have another read through Cadre Building Best Practice (CBBP). This is the backdrop for all of the points I'm about to discuss.

Here is the original post. I've added my comments in italicized brackets.





I am going to use this as a mostly static army with a few mobile units such as: my crisis suits, stealth suits and my gun drones.

[Excellent summary; the inclusion of your intended playstyle is important for those who will respond.]

HQ-Shas'O- burst cannon, plasma rifle, shield generator, and stimulant injectors 133 pts.

[Missing the Hardwired Multitracker. Double check your post for accuracy and completeness (#2 in the CBBP).]

HQ-Ethereal with HWDC, 2 shield drones, and 12 FW bodyguards with pulse rifles 224 pts.

Elite- Monat with plasma rifle, flamer, and multitracker 49 pts.

Elite- Fireforge with multitracker 54 pts.

[Suit nicknames should only be used for casual discussion (frequently during tactics discussions), not in army lists. This reduces the chance of miscommunication and makes your list more accessible to those who don't have the nicknames memorized.]

Elite- 6 stealth team, Team Leader 185 pts.

Troops- 2x12 FWs with pulse rifles 240 pts.

[Separate this out into two separate line items]

Troops- 12 Kroot 84 pts.

Troops- 16 Kroot 112 pts.

Fast Attack- 6 pathfinders with 'fish 152 pts.

Fast Attack- 6 gun drones 72 pts.

Heavy Support- Sniper team 80 pts.

[The inclusion of a points total for each unit entry is good. The formatting is almost there, but doesn't quite follow the posted Army List Formatting Guide.]

Total: 1365 pts.

[What size is the list supposed to be? Is it a 1500 pt list that needs to be filled out, or a 1250 list that needs to be trimmed down?]


I don't need 16 kroot or gun drones if they are not needed please make suggestions. For my crisis suits suggest wargear to be added on. Thanks for reading my army list.

[Mentioning units you're on the fence about is a good idea. However, you should also mention units that you have available to add (#3 in the CBBP). Are there certain units you just can't stand and refuse to use no matter what? This is all important information.

It's important to include a summary of what your goal is with this list (#1 in the CBBP). Are you entering a tournament? Are you just starting and looking to build a "standard" list to play with friends? Are you going to be playing themed games in a narrative campaign? Or do you just think your list is hot stuff and want to show it off? All of these are perfectly acceptable reasons to post a list on ATT, but it's important to let your potential respondents know what your shooting for so they can better tailor their replies.

It's also important to include information about your local metagame. What sorts of opponents do you usually play? Do you usually play on 4x4 tables, 4x6 tables, or 4x8 tables? Lots of terrain or planet bowling ball? What armies do you face most frequently? What playstyles do they use?]






I'll now re-type out the above list in a more ATT-friendly manner.


Hi ATT,

I've been lurking for a few weeks and have learned a lot from reading through the many great discussions in the various forums. I've been recently convinced to start a WH40K army by a friend and have chosen to begin with the Tau. I really like the background and imagery. So far I've purchased the Megaforce and have gotten in a few early games with my "grey Tau of doom"; great fun! I'm looking to expand my army with the goal of eventually playing in a monthly tournament hosted by my local gaming shop (1500 pts).

[A brief introduction to the "purpose" of your topic.]

In my early matches, I've noticed that I tend to get caught in assault by my friend's bikers and other fast moving assault troops (he runs mostly infantry, very few vehicles), so I'm looking to add some efficient static firepower to give me a better shot at taking him down before he can reach my lines. Though I'm a little concerned about my ability to take objectives in Recon and Secure and Control type missions (we play random missions from the rulebook). We usually play on a 4x6 table with the recommended 25% terrain coverage, although our store is unfortunately light on area terrain; only 1 woods and 1 ruin! and they're both usually taken by the time I get there :sad: Most of the pieces we use are large rocks, hills, or impassible buildings, as well as a smattering of linear obstacles like sandbags, tank traps and razor wire.

[Discussion of available terrain, usual opponents, and previous difficulties.]

Anyway, enough chit chat, onto the list!

HQ - Shas'O Commander: 133 pts
1x Shas'O; Burst Cannon; Plasma Rifle; Shield Generator; Hardwired Multitracker; Stimulant Injectors

HQ - Ethereal with Bodyguard: 224 pts
1x Ethereal; HWDC + 2 Shield Drones
12x Firewarrior Bodyguard with Pulse Rifles

Elites - XV8 Crisis Battlesuit: 49 pts
1x Crisis Suit; Plasma Rifle; Flamer; Multitracker

Elites - XV8 Crisis Battlesuit: 54 pts
1x Crisis Suit; Fusion Blaster; Missile Pod; Multitracker

Elites - XV25 Stealth Battlesuits: 185 pts
6x Stealth Suits; Teamleader

Troops - Firewarrior Team 120: pts
12x Firewarriors with Pulse Rifles

Troops - Firewarrior Team 120: pts
12x Firewarriors with Pulse Rifles

Troops - Kroot Carnivore Squad: 84 pts
12x Kroot

Troops - Kroot Carnivore Squad: 112 pts
16x Kroot

Fast Attack - Pathfinder Team: 152 pts
6x Pathfinders
1x Devilfish

Fast Attack - Gun Drone Squadron: 72 pts
6x Gun Drones

Heavy Support - Sniper Drone Team: 80 pts
1x Sniper Drone Team


Total: 1365 pts

[Proper format listed in the List Style Guide.]


Those are my initial thoughts. I've noticed that Aun and Bodyguard aren't included much among the vets, but I like the imagery and love the model, so I'm going to stick with him. Besides, the BS4 Firewarriors are ace! The rest of the army deploys with good firelanes on likely enemy approaches, being sure to stay > 6" from each other (so he can't consolidate from one unit to the next), while simultaneously remaining in line of sight of the centrally located Ethereal. The Kroot hang back and contribute shots while moving in to countercharge if anything gets too close.

[A brief discussion about how you usually deploy and manoeuvre is good.]

I really like Iron-Fist's discussion of a small Pathfinder unit in a Dumbfish here, and I've included something similar as a result. This small unit will give me a few Markerlight hits that I'll usually use to boost the BS of my Firewarriors. They'll hop in their transport and scoot away if anything gets too close. The minimum 'fish will also be useful for capturing objectives in the later turns.

[References to other discussions on the site are good; it helps convey your ideas about your own army while simultaneously letting us know that you've done your homework and have been reading up on your own.]

My Crisis Suits are configured to deal with specific threats; the Fireforge is to deal with any vehicular surprises (I'll usually deep strike him in this case), and the Plasma/Flamer suit works as a nice last-ditch anti-infantry grenade along with the Shas'O in order to take out anything that is about to assault my lines the next turn. I'll occasionally even assault with this pair (is that a good idea? I've had mixed results...).

[A brief description of how you intend to use each unit, and why you've chosen to equip them as such.]

So that's my tentative battle plan. Do you think a 1500 pt list based around this concept will do well against an infantry-heavy assault-oriented force? What do you think of the Crisis loadouts? I'm not to keen on just spamming Fireknives so I was going for a bit of variety. Am I hurting myself by not taking the "fallback Fireknife"? Do you think I'll have enough mobility to capture objectives in the late game with (Pathfinders, Gun Drones, and Battlesuits)? Since I'm intending to enter an RTT with Theme and Composition scores, do you think I'll do well here? I'm hoping the Ethereal will help with that. Any ideas about what to do with the extra 135 points? Since I haven't bought the models yet to expand my force to 1500 pts, I can include pretty much anything :D

[Pointed, direct questions about specific things in the list.]





Hopefully this sort of point-by-point breakdown in this case study will help those looking to make a good first impression with their army list on ATT. I would like ATT vets to please reply with additional comments about "how to make a good first impression" with an army list in the hopes of getting new folks off on the right foot. What do you respond well to? What don't you respond well to?

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Mont'sha
Shas
Posts: 221
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Post#2 » Oct 27 2007 12:16

ooh, this is comforting. I was always worried I would put too much information in. Thank you Tonka.

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Eiglepulper
Shas'O
Posts: 5389

Post#3 » Feb 28 2008 02:37

I respond better to a post which has obviously had time and effort spent on it, rather than someone merely putting up a bunch of things with a "whatcha'll think?" request for comments and assistance.

E.

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kai'lore
Aun'O (Ret.)
Posts: 3480

Post#4 » Feb 28 2008 09:18

thank you very much for your efforts on this T0nka, sincerely appreciated. This is excellent advice!

I've just re-read the sticky and also think it's very easy to follow and gives a good overview. Must have had a moment of clarity with that one...

If I may add one more thing, it might be an idea to bullet point and or Bold your questions. It's the internet and people skim, questions are sadly often overlooked and many people are trained by the internet at large to quickly respond to posts as soon as possible with the first ideas that pop into their head when skimming your list.

Please help and direct them, it is in your own best interests and theirs as well.
Please visit my New Online Gallery Scale120

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shasocastris
Shas'Vre
Posts: 962
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Re: How to Post an Army List

Post#5 » Jan 28 2013 01:32

How does one post an army list that has a planned expansion.

For example, when I make army lists, I generally make 1850 lists, with an expansion to 2000 or 2500. It helps me to get a better handle on how I want the army to operate at all levels.

So, along the lines of the sample army list by T0nka:




(... Main Army List ..., pretending the goal is to be a 1500 point list.)

Those are my thoughts on what I would do for a 1500 point list. Below is a sample list expansion to 1850.

[An indication that the following is an expansion to the previous army list.]

HQ - Bodyguard Team (for the Shas'o): 186 pts
2x Shas'vre; Burst Cannon; Plasma Rifle; Targeting Array; Hard-wired Multi-tracker; Hard-wired Drone Controller; 1 Shield Drone

Heavy Support - Broadside Team: 160 pts
2x Shas'ui; Targeting Array

In larger games, I suspect that my commander will be a more high priority target, and so I've decided to give him bodyguards. They also are all at least BS 4, which gives more high powered fire power that I'll need to deal with tougher targets.

The Broadside Team has been included because I'm not confident that the current anti-tank firepower of the army is enough to deal with armour at higher points levels. They are given targeting arrays over advanced stablisation systems because the army as a whole is generally static. I'd rather have more of a chance to eliminate enemy heavy armour vs limited mobility.

[What the new units are for.]

Instead of the Broadsides, would people instead finding a few extra points and including a Hammerhead instead? Does the army need more mobility or does it have enough firepower to make up for the lack of mobility?

[Question about the new units.]




Thoughts on a format like this?

Cheers!

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Lyi'ot
Por'O
Posts: 2730

Re: How to Post an Army List

Post#6 » Jan 29 2013 02:30

Many moons ago -- five years to be precise -- I wrote up a rather "fluffy" army list for my cadre. By all accounts, I'm a terrible list builder. But I really liked the aesthetic of my post, so I thought I'd reproduce it here as another example of list making. The most obvious difference between Tael's excellent template and my example is that I prefer organize wargear vertically, rather than horizontally.



Ko’vash’ya Cadre, “Lance Strike” Configuration

History
Ko’vash’ya Cadre is a “vanguard” cadre, tasked with exploring the Empire’s periphery. It was founded in 760.M41, under the command of the illustrious Shas’o Fal’shia O’ran Or’es. In the Imperial tounge, Ko’vash’ya translates roughly to “a worthy cause between spheres.” Like many Tau words, it is a compound phrase with several metaphorical meanings. “Vash’ya” translates to “between spheres,” a reference to both the cadre’s mission and its time of founding. “Ko’vash” can be translated as “worthy cause,” and expressed the high esteem O’ran placed on intelligence acquisition.

At present, the cadre is commanded by Or’es’ successor, Shas’el Fal’shia Lyi’ot. Instrumental to the cadre’s success is the ability of his second, Shas’vre Kel’shan M’yenshi.


“Lance Strike” Configuration
The nature of the Ko’vash’ya’s work rarely calls for direct confrontation; the cadre prefers gathering strategic intelligence to inflicting enemy casualties. El’lyi’ot prefers the Shas’len’ra – the Cautious Warrior – over the more conventional Mont’ka and Kauyon tactical philosophies. The cadre is constantly encountering new alien life forms; on more than one occasion, El’lyi’ot’s patience and caution has averted unnecessary bloodshed.

Unfortunately, many races do not initially see the wisdom of the Greater Good, and the technological, military, and cultural might of the Tau Empire must be forcibly impressed upon them. El’lyi’ot often employs a modified “Lance Strike” configuration, which he has named “The Current and the Shoal.” The cadre is divided into three parts:
- El’lyi’ot personally leads the “Current”, a mechanized taskforce designed to seize far-flung objectives. If necessary, he can focus his forces against one enemy flank in an attempt to destroy it.
- Lyi’ot’s second, Shas’vre M’yenshi, leads a team of Broadside pilots that anchors the “Shoal.” Supported by mobile dismounted infantry, the Shoal provides covering fire for the first lance, all the while possessing the staying power to hold any objectives within the deployment zone.
- Outside of either lance is the “Savon detachment.” Composed of the cadre’s Pathfinders, Stealth Suits, and Kroot squads, these fighters infiltrate onto the battlefield before the outbreak of hostilities, surprising friend and foe alike.




After reading Ol'oi E'st's thread on a so-called 'Lance Strike' configuration, I decided to try my hand at making a fluffy, fun army list that incorporated his ideas. One thing that he did that I disliked was making the two lances carbon copies; in my army, I've tried to create two completely different lances, but keep them at the same point value and combat effectiveness.

Like Ol'oi E'st, I play a lot of Rules of Engagement. In designing this army, I wanted both lances to be be able to hold objectives while maintaining some movement and flexibility. Most controversial is probably my inclusion of a third part, the "Savon" detachment. I felt it was a very fluffy addition, especially saying that its constituent parts are often afforded a great deal more flexibility than rest of the cadre.

If I was really seriously making this list, I'd drop the Pathfinders for Commander Shadowsun, using her to bolster the Leadership of my dismounted infantry. With two fusion blasters on the line, I'd then drop the Helios. Practically, I own all of these models except the Kroot (the Kroot are the sole providence of my girlfriend), so I'd drop them as well. With the extra ~200 points, I'd bring another Broadside and a non-markerlight team of Stealth suits, replacing some of the infiltration/flanking ability I lost with the Kroot. In fact, with the removal of the Pathfinders, the Savon section could probably be disassembled, moving this army a bit closer to the original "dual lance" idea.



Lancer Strike Alpha - 638 points
"We come in peace, alien. Do not force our hand."
- Shas'el Lyi'ot


Shas’el Lyi’ot w/ Bodyguard (245)
- [Centurion: Shas’el, Plasma Rifle, Cyclic Ion Blaster, Targeting Array, HW Multitracker]
- [Firestorm: Shas’vre, Burst Cannon, Missile Pod, Targeting Array, HW Multitracker] (70)
- [Firestorm: Shas’vre, Burst Cannon, Missile Pod, Targeting Array, HW Multitracker, HW Target Lock] (75)

2 Crisis Suits (113)
- [Firestorm: Team Leader, Burst Cannon, Missile Pod, Targeting Array, HW Multitracker] (65)
- [Deathrain: Twin-linked Missile Pod, Target Lock] (48)

10 Fire Warriors (115)
- [Shas’ui, Bonding]
- [10 Rifles]

Skyray Missile Defense Gunship (165)
- [Smart Missile System, Multitracker, Targeting Array, Disruption Pods]

I've chosen Firestorms as the predominant 'suit of Ko'vash'ya; they're good skirmishers that have a high volume of fire and the range necessary to fire from a distance - what else could you want in a cadre designed to feel out new alien threats?
I recognize this is suppose to be the "mobile" lance, and that rifled-toting warriors seem out of place. However, they'll be able to run, and I intend for the Pathfinder Devilfish to give them a hand.
Lastly, the Skyray. Extremely mobile markerlights, I believe this baby can get in some good Strength 8 shots against side armor. Or squash pesky Plague Marines.



Lancer Strike Omega - 572 pts.
"Oh, don't worry. I'll reach out and touch 'em."
- Shas'vre M'yenshi


Shas’vre M’yenshi w/Broadside Detachment (200)
- [Shas’vre, BASS, HW DC + 2 Shield Drones]
- [BASS]

Monat Broadside (115)
- [Team Leader, BASS, HW DC + 2 Shield Drones]

Monat Crisis Suit (67)
- [Helios: Team Leader, Fusion Blaster, Plasma Rifle, Targeting Array, HW Multitracker]

8 Fire Warriors (95)
- [Shas’ui, Bonding]
- [8 Carbines]

8 Fire Warriors (95)
- [Shas’ui, Bonding]
- [8 Carbines]

"Shoal" can be a sandbar, or a school of fish. I thought the name appropriate: anchored Broadside units providing support to dismounted infantry.
The way Ko'vash'ya's Broadsides are organized, they can engage three different targets every turn. The Shield Drones will make them especially resilient.
The Helios is designed to truly be a "crisis" suit - running along the battleline, busting open hard targets the Shas'la can't. If needed, he can deepstrike.
The Fire Warriors can run forward and claim objectives, or stay back and hold the deployment zone.



Savon Detachment - 540 points
"Shas'el... it's the Kroot. They reached the objective before we did. They've... they've slaughtered the gue'la."
- Comm chatter, Battle for Agrapi Pass 864.M41


10 Kroot (70)

10 Kroot (70)

5 Pathfinder Team (75)
- [Shas’ui, Bonding Knife]
+ Devilfish (85)
- [Disruption Pods]

3 Stealth Suit Marker Team (240)
- [Team Leader, Markerlight, Targeting Array, Bonding]
- [DC + 2 Marker Drones]
- [DC + 2 Marker Drones]

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