Agents 1500 mechanized

A review of past Cadre formations from tau'cyr before.
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Agent00abe
Shas'Ui
Shas'Ui
Posts: 331

Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#1 » Feb 01 2013 07:37

So I saw Shas'La - Da Skyman post his mecha list over here and I saw that it was very similar to mine. I decided to post mine and tell about my experience so far.
The largest factor I had to consider while building this list was the minis I had available. ( I have no Crisis suits aside the two commanders I have )

The list was built around survivability and evasion.
I wanted mobility from every aspect of the army.
With this in mind I had already decided that NO unit in my army would be foot slugging it.
My biggest asset would come from the stealth suits and cover save shenanigans.

Right, on to the list.

HQ Shas'el commander: 128pt
HW Blacksun, Shield Dronex2, HW Multitracker, HW Targetlock, TL Fusion Blaster, Missile Pod, Bonding Knife

HQ Shas'el commander: 128pt
HW Blacksun, Shield Dronex2, HW Multitracker, HW Targetlock, TL Fusion Blaster, Missile Pod, Bonding Knife

Elite XV25 Stealthsuits: 122pt
Stealthsuits x3, Fusion Blaster, Targetin Arrayx3

Elite XV25 Stealthsuits: 122pt
Stealthsuits x3, Fusion Blaster, Targetin Arrayx3

Fast Attack Tetra Scout Speeder: 75pt
Sensorspines, Targeting Array, Blacksun, Decoy Launchers

Fast Attack Tetra Scout Speeder: 75pt
Sensorspines, Targeting Array, Blacksun, Decoy Launchers

Heavy Support Hammerhead: 225pt
Railgun, SMS, Sensor Spines, Targetlock, Multitracker, Flechette, Dpod, Seeker Missilesx2, Blacksun

Troop Firewarriors: 208pt
Firewarriorsx8, Shas'ui, Bonding Knife, HW Blacksun, Devilfish, Dpod, Seeker Missilesx2, Blacksun

Troop Firewarriors: 208pt
Firewarriorsx8, Shas'ui, Bonding Knife, HW Blacksun, Devilfish, Dpod, Seeker Missilesx2, Blacksun

Troop Firewarriors: 208pt
Firewarriorsx8, Shas'ui, Bonding Knife, HW Blacksun, Devilfish, Dpod, Seeker Missilesx2, Blacksun

Total points: 1499

Deployment.
So we have two identical Shas'el and two identical XV25 teams.
They deploy together, either on board or in deepstrike reserve.
The idea here is, that the commanders have bonding knife and and shield drones to protect the Stealthsuits, while the Stealthsuits have stealth and shroud to protect the commanders.
Tetras are also deployed on board using terrain to deny the enemy an early advantage by destroying our scouts.
The Hammerhead is deployed using the same method as the Tetras.
As for the Firewarriors they can be deployed however the terrain and mission allows. IE. In reserve if that would be the best tactical decision or if the terrain doesn't allow for safe deployment.


The general Idea.
My logic behind all this is, that my stealthsuits + commanders deal with threats while the Firewarriors set up for kill zones and/or objective grabbing. The Hammerhead is a wildcard. It serves multiple roles, anything from antihorde to bullet magnet.
My commanders and Stealthsuits are well protected and will be able to soak up a lot of fire-power protecting the Firewarriors.
Cover is of utmost importance since we will be relying on stealth+shroud and shield drones as fall back safety if cover fails us.
All vehicles have an abundance of safety precautions and we should take advantage of that each and every round. Always move when possible and always either be in cover or provide cover for Firewarriors.
The Tetras are best used on a far flank so that the enemy must go out of his way if he wants to deal with them. Note that the Tetras are two separate units.

When I made the list I started with two Hammerheads and only two units of Firewarriors.
I made a choice to sack the Ionhead and instead bring in a third unit of Firewarriors complete with Devilfish.
It could be argued that one could cut a Devilfish and have the affected Firewarriors baby-sit deployment objectives, but I'd rather have the safety and mobility of a Devilfish if it turns out we don't need a babysitter.



My first game using this list was VS Blood Angels.
I've always been scared of fast armies and drop pods, that is why I chose to go for this mobile / survivable list.
The game was close and even though he managed to murder quite a few of my vehicles he had a hard time connecting with my units.
Most of the game was spent running from one far side to the other. I thought I was doing okay and had a plan to snatch up objectives late game but he foiled it all when he told me mid game that his HQ and entourage was scoring units :( I had used my attention on murdering his other scoring units and was content to kiting his HQ bomb around the map. When late game came I ALMOST managed to whipe his objectives clean and keep some of mine, but in my zealously defending my Shas'la I ended giving up my warlord. He ended up winning.
Most valuable tau units that game ended up being Stealthsuits + Commander for survivability and Tetras for harassment. The scouts actually managed to kill off some scout marines with the twinlinked Pulse Carbines.
Does this Railgun make me look fat?

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Das'Kyman
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 1161

Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#2 » Feb 01 2013 10:10

Thanks for posting this! It helps to see other mech lists and how they are used.

One thing, not sure if you just mispoke or not, but aren't Tetras armed with twin-linked pulse rifles?
Also, how did you like the fully kitted out Hammerhead? I've always dragged my feet about putting hammerheads over the 200 pt mark.

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boomwolf
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 1769

Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#3 » Feb 01 2013 11:13

Well, its a nice concept, and a pretty interesting list. but I can see a few flaws in it with things that re not as effective as they could be, upgrades that are pretty much useless, and

If you intend of teaming the shas'el with the stealths, you will be better served with gun drones then shield ones.
Also TA on stealth with a BC is not effective, a single gun drone is actually better both kill-wise and for body count.
Remove blacksun from tetra, its not worth it one them. markerlight don't care about night fight anyway, and the pulse rifle is not good enough to spend points at. sensor spines are also not needed as it has a D-pod and being a skimmer it has 3+ cover at all time even out in the open as long you are 12' away, and being a fast skimmer this should be easy to keep your distance and avoid landing in cover. decoy launchers are as well not needed.
Hammerhead also don't need sensor spines for the same reason, nor does it needs flechette. its usually wont do anything, and when it does it will do very little, and burst cannons and cheaper and usually better then the SMS.
All seeker missiles should be dropped, they are highly ineffective for their cost.
Devilfish needs no blacksun, it lacks the range for it to matter.

Removing all said overburdening gear of tanks, removing the shield drones from the shas'el and giving 2 drones to each non-fusion stealth member instead of the TA will net you a saving of 185 points, enough to bring back the second hammerhead with railgun, Dpod, burst cannons, TL and MT, and give your warlord the stimulate injector.

Overall these changes will allow you to keep about as much mobility and defenses, and gain a lot more firepower.

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Agent00abe
Shas'Ui
Shas'Ui
Posts: 331

Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#4 » Feb 01 2013 01:00

Boomwolf:
Interesting points you raise.
Though on the gun drones for Stealthsuits issue. Having a higher body count also means a larger footprint.
I'm not fond of that. Also the shield drones provide the 4++ and they bring the same toughness as the commander, which gun drones wouldn't.
Other than that it might be worth it to do as you suggest (though I'd probably bring an Ionhead).
What concerns me is that all that "overburdening gear" brings redundancy and failsafe. You can argue that it's useless, but it brings ease to my mind.
Still worth looking at though :)

Da Skyman:
You might be right on that. I was just thinking twinlinking and drones. :D
Does this Railgun make me look fat?

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boomwolf
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 1769

Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#5 » Feb 01 2013 01:43

While it's true that shield drone provide a 4++ and copy the T4 of the commander, the gun drones are cheaper, so you can field more of them for the same cost (or an many for cheaper if you don't want a larger foorprint), add a bit of firepower, and enjoy the SFG of the suits granting them stealth and shrouded at all times-therefor at the very worst the have 4+ armor and 4+ cover and often better and considering only a handful of guns are both AP 4 or higher and ignore cover, its almost as good as the invul.
Plus, extra drones cover for the slightly worse defenses with more wounds.

I would personally use them over shields for anything except broadsides.

And as a general premises, gun drones are best served as a side-dish to stealth teams.


As for the redundancy you mentioned, they might provide "backups", but with the new glancing rules, said backups are decreasingly effective, as even triggering the decoys means the tetra has lost 50% of its HP, if not killed then and there already. sensor spines are an overkill considering we have no need at all to even go into cover from the firstplace, you should get either the OR the pods, not both (and you get free pods on tetras)
Seeker missiles on the other hand are just so ineffective at actually killing the target you point them at (and waste a marker while at it) that a single broadside with A.S.S will be better then all 8 of them. if you don't like broadsides, then increasing warrior squad size is another more effective usage of the point.

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Ell'ran
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Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#6 » Feb 01 2013 03:23

Boomwolf makes quite a few good points as far as trimming the fat in your list goes. However, one thing that I noticed was the fact that the Shas'el with 2 Shield Drones attached to a unit of 3 stealths makes the XV25 unit T4. I'm not sure if that was intentional or not, but it sure is interesting.

Regarding Seeker missiles, I find that they are better anti-infantry weapons than anti-vehicle. After all, they will hit on 2+, wound on 2+, ignore armor saves for anything short of a TEQ, and remove FNP from those pesky Blood Angels that the OP is facing. Even against most Monstrous Creatures the Seeker wounds on a 2+, which is pretty nifty.

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Agent00abe
Shas'Ui
Shas'Ui
Posts: 331

Re: Agents 1500 mechanized

Post#7 » Feb 01 2013 06:00

Boomwolf:
You are absolutely right.
However Ell'ran said exactly what I was thinking, only better explained.
The T4 stealthsuits was intended. And the Seekers are able to take out stuff that the rest of the army might have a hard time with. Also, they make sure that I'm not putting a lot of eggs in one basket. If a vehicle get's blown and the seekers lost it's less of a loss than if all the points from the seekers went into say a Hammerhead that is blown up.
With 2x heavy4 markerlight there will be a time where I'm not able to burn them all for +BS
That does not mean that I'm not taking your points into consideration, and I probably might do as you suggest when I face a different meta than the one with the Blood Angels ;)
Does this Railgun make me look fat?

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