Farsight 1850

A review of past Cadre formations from tau'cyr before.
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shasocastris
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Farsight 1850

Post#1 » Feb 08 2013 10:41

ATT,

I've been having a flurry of thoughts regarding army lists of late. After reading Carrelio's post, I wanted to use some of what I learned from his army list and incorporate it into something radically different.

Throughout 5th edition, I became a great fan of Farsight. It is true, on the face of everything, he's actually rather terrible. He is far overcosted (his wargear+stats gets him to maybe 150 pts), and has high restrictions on the army list.

And yet, the one advantage he does have, a Tau with a power weapon, was worth its weight in gold. The one weakness of the Tau, the basic inability to fight in CC, was overcome. To be sure, he couldn't go toe-to-toe with Thunderwolves or Nob Bikers, but no longer could my line be hindered by some outflanking marines that are just there to tie up my army. Suddenly, I had the capability to beat the snot out of them.

Of course, Farsight isn't really used unless he has a bodyguard with a plethora of shield drones to protect him from enemy shooting. In 5th ed, the unit abused wound allocation as much as possible. In 6th ed, there are different bonuses that can be used, in particular joining a second commander to the unit who has a Vectored Retro-thruster. The tactic is discussed here, so I won't go into it now, but the main point is that as long as the commander and Farsight are alive, the entire unit can Hit & Run at Initiative 5.

Another reason to take Farsight is the new Warlord traits. Normal commanders generally don't benefit from all Warlord traits like other commanders do (who needs to charge an extra 1"?), but Farsight generally can. I usually take Personal for the traits, because he can benefit from them all.

The rest of the army list is a bit tricky. Farsight's unit takes up ~500 points. It does however have firepower, and acts (until it's needed in CC) a powerful crisis team. In my case it's outfitted with plasma rifles and fusion blasters (to compliment Farsight). The main thing is to ensure there is enough AT firepower to open transports and let Farsight deal with what is inside.

The last thing to note is that my gaming group came to a fair comprimise with FW models and Farsight. As the rules for Farsight's restrictions don't specifically include Tetras, Hazards, etc, RAW you could take multiple units. However we decided that to keep in the spirit of things (and so they let me use Tetras), the FW from the Tau update follow the 0-1 restrictions. On to the army list!

HQ - Commander Farsight: 394 pts
1x Farsight
2x Shas'vre; Plasma Rifle; Fusion Blaster; Targeting Array; HW Multi-tracker; HW Drone Controller; 2 Shield Drones

HQ - Commander: 102 pts
1x Shas'el; Plasma Rifle; Fusion Blaster; Vectored Retro-thrusters; HW Multi-tracker

Elites - Crisis Team: 197
1x Shas'ui; TL Fusion Blaster; 2 Shield Drones
2x Shas'ui; Plasma Rifle; Fusion Blaster; Multi-tracker

Elites - Crisis Team: 167 pts
1x Shas'ui team leader; TL Missile Pod; Targeting Array; HW Blacksun Filter
2x Shas'ui; TL Missile Pod, Targeting Array

Troops - Fire Warrior Team: 215 pts
1x Shas'ui; HW Drone Controller; Gun Drone
10x Shas'la
1x Devilfish; Disruption Pod

Troops - Fire Warrior Team: 215 pts
1x Shas'ui; Hard-wired Drone Controller; Gun Drone
10x Shas'la
1x Devilfish; Disruption Pod

Troops - Fire Warrior Team: 165 pts
8x Shas'la
1x Devilfish; Disruption Pod

Fast Attack - Tetra Squadron: 115 pts
1x Tetra; Targeting Array
1x Tetra; Targeting Array; Target Lock

Heavy Support - Broadside Team: 278 pts
1x Shas'ui team leader; Targeting Array; HW Drone Controller; 2 Shield Drones; HW Target Lock; HW Blacksun Filter
1x Shas'ui; Targeting Array
1x Shas'ui; Target Lock

Total: 1848

Farsight's unit is basically designed to hid hard, fast and leave death behind. The Shas'el goes with the team always, and generally stays behind the other models. And the unit generally does get markerlight support from the Tetras if needed.

The Broadsides and Tetras and Deathrain Crisis team are fairly self-explanatory. The Broadsides and deathrains are to deal with enemy armour. The Tetras are a general support unit relying on their 3+ cover save to stay alive. The other crisis team generally deep strikes. It acts as general support to Farsight's unit, deep striking so it can shoot at least once before it gets blown away. When this unit comes down, it sometimes becomes Farsight's job to eliminate a unit that would otherwise threaten the helios team

The Fire Warrior Teams primarily stay in their transports unless absolutely needed. When this happens, the two larger teams tend to work in tandem to eliminate a threat. As with Carrelio's list, the single gun drone is so that the team has I 4 for sweeping advances.

The smaller team stays in reserve. It's task is to go after objectives that the larger teams abandoned for tactical reasons. Generally this means they get the objective in my deployment zone.

So what are everyone's thoughts on the list? One change I can see making is making the smaller fire warrior team a cheap hammerhead instead, but I'd rather have a 3rd scoring unit.

Cheers!

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boomwolf
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#2 » Feb 08 2013 11:44

You ARE aware that the 'vre bodyguards can also take the vector thruster, right?
It seems to me that a larger bodyguard instead of the 'el will be beneficial.
(this is WRONG. ignore.)

Also, for the existing bodyguards, I would not go for fusion, but for burst cannons. it will give much more of a punch against infantry with a bit of range, and against tanks you can change anyway as you will probably glance anything to death, the dawnblade is great there.

Also, the first Crisis team (TL fusion+2 fusion/plasma) seems a bit off track to me. what purpose does this unit serve? they are too expensive for suicide attack, but lacks the kit to do anything else.

In regard of the third firewarrior team, I would skip the fish. no point guarding 8 guys with a fish, you might as well just pump out more guys, I find that having a few pulse rifles throw shots from the distance can help whittle down targets for the suits, and having more then two fished teams looks like an overkill to me. I would vote for 2 teams of 12 of foot that start on board as fire support, with 2 small teams in reserve inside the fishes, I think it will preform better in the rule you intend them to do.

Also, don't forget to add a bonding knife to every team leader and shas'vre, it may not worth much, but with farsight around its free.
Last edited by boomwolf on Feb 08 2013 01:28, edited 1 time in total.

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Carrelio
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#3 » Feb 08 2013 12:15

Sorry, Boom, I disagree on every point you just made :P Castris is making a list right after my own heart (which makes sense given the source of inspiration for his list ;) ).

Vre' that can join the Farsight bomb cannot take VRT. They are only for monat battlesuits without drones. He's using the Farsight H&R abuse tactic.

He's got enough S5 AP5, the fusion blaster will be more flexible than the burst cannon for his purposes.

There is always a point to the fish. Fire warriors improved a lot in 6th, but one place they didn't improve was defensively. 6-12 Fire warriors (doesn't actually matter how many you have) will still die exactly the same now as they did back in 5th edition. Scoring is even more valuable now than it used to be, so why not keep those scoring units mobile, alive, and scoring?

One final bit of rule abuse this list could use is as follows. By dropping a fire warrior from each of the first 2 units you now have 20 points to spare with which to upgrade the third team to have a shas'ui with gun drone. This abuses 2 points. First, it gets you another gun drone. Second, it means that against incoming fire that unit now has to lose 3 models before it takes a moral check, instead of the 2 it would take at 8 models.

The TLFB on the elite does have me a little stumped too... why?

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shasocastris
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#4 » Feb 08 2013 01:04

I think about changing around the Fire Warrior Teams. Too be honest though, the 8-man team should really NEVER see combat. If they have to claim an objective, they'll be hiding behind their devilfish (perhaps when its landed?), so I'm not sold on giving them anything except an extra two guys to take hits. I've used units like it before. It works ok. I will try the modification to it though.

Carrelio wrote:The TLFB on the elite does have me a little stumped too... why?

So, this goes back actually to 5th edition. The origins was finding a helios team that would maximize wound allocation and firepower.

A straight helios team (3x shas'ui w/ pr, fb, mt) kills 3.75 marines at 12". However, it lacks shield drones, thus I went on a crusade to try and optimize the unit.

At first, I came up with this unit:
Elites - Crisis Team: 224 pts
1x Shas'ui team leader; Plasma Rifle; Fusion Blaster; Targeting Array; HW Multi-tracker; HW Drone Controller; 1 Shield Drone
1x Shas'ui; TL Plasma Rifle; Drone Controller; 1 Shield Drone
1x Shas'ui; Plasma Rifle; Fusion Blaster; Multi-tracker

Each model is unique, increasing survivability, and it actually kills ~4.2 marines at 12". However, I came up against the fact that in my gaming group, I more often needed a TL fusion blaster, vs TL plasma rifle. It was also cheaper. So I began to use it. It had a rather illustrious history vs dreadnoughts, wraithlords, thunderwolf cavalry and other rather tough things.

The current design ignores wound allocation and goes for inexpensiveness. I didn't necessarily want to pay the 5 pts for a team leader, but I did want the shield drones, so one helios member became a sunforge suit with 2 shield drones.

However, I'm not sold on the unit. If you guys think the points would be better spent somewhere else, feel free to make suggestions.

Cheers!

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Carrelio
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#5 » Feb 08 2013 01:21

Don't land your devilfish! Don't do it!!! The second that thing isn't moving flat out it's little more than a slightly over glorified and very expensive rhino. Just use the low flight base, it gives you the same effect without the dead vehicles.

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boomwolf
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#6 » Feb 08 2013 01:27

Rechecked the RVT rules, it appears I was mistaken, my apology.

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shasocastris
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#7 » Feb 08 2013 01:36

Carrelio wrote:Don't land your devilfish! Don't do it!!! The second that thing isn't moving flat out it's little more than a slightly over glorified and very expensive rhino. Just use the low flight base, it gives you the same effect without the dead vehicles.

Haha, good call. I'll make sure to stock up on a few low bases ;)

Cheers!

im2randomghgh
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#8 » Feb 08 2013 06:32

My suggestion would be to drop one broadside, the shield drones on the 'normal' crisis suit team, buy disruption pods for your tetras and field this as a 1750 list.

If you are set on an 1850 list, I would drop one fish (you'll probably put at LEAST one fire warrior team on a home objective) and two firewarriors (squads of 10, rather than 11) and use the 105 points to buy 2 crisis suits with BC/MP, as well as the BSF on the deathrains (AP4 doesn't ignore armour all that often) and use the 10 points left over to buy disruption pods for your tetras [they are squishy, priority targets-a dangerous combination. 3+/2+ cover makes them NOT squishy, and is therefore awesome :-)]
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Carrelio
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#9 » Feb 08 2013 07:38

I may be entirely off on this... but I am pretty sure the disruption pod is built in to the tetra already.

Further, they are not as useful as they used to be since the change to wound allocation but shield drones are never a bad idea on suits, it's a free wound and protection from powerfists and S8 sniping.

I won't go in to the to fish or not to fish argument again, but I think all fire warriors benefit from them.

im2randomghgh
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#10 » Feb 08 2013 08:34

Carrelio wrote:Further, they are not as useful as they used to be since the change to wound allocation but shield drones are never a bad idea on suits, it's a free wound and protection from powerfists and S8 sniping.


The reason I suggested it was because crisis suits (particularly those found in the elites section) will still die fairly easily to bolter fire (even if you have three suits all with 2 shield drones, they will die easier than a tactical squad, which happens to be both cheaper and a troops unit). It is generally advisable to try and keep their cost down, and their firepower up. Their mobility is what keeps them safe, usually!

Different people have different opinions on the matter of more guns/tougher guns, but crisis suits are already an expensive unit, and two shield drones won't change the fact that they are a glass cannon.
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shasocastris
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Re: Farsight 1850

Post#11 » Feb 08 2013 09:28

im2randomghgh wrote:My suggestion would be to drop one broadside, the shield drones on the 'normal' crisis suit team, buy disruption pods for your tetras and field this as a 1750 list.

If you are set on an 1850 list, I would drop one fish (you'll probably put at LEAST one fire warrior team on a home objective) and two firewarriors (squads of 10, rather than 11) and use the 105 points to buy 2 crisis suits with BC/MP, as well as the BSF on the deathrains (AP4 doesn't ignore armour all that often) and use the 10 points left over to buy disruption pods for your tetras [they are squishy, priority targets-a dangerous combination. 3+/2+ cover makes them NOT squishy, and is therefore awesome :-)]


Tetras come with disruption pods...

And why should this list be 1750? Obviously I can make a 1750 list, but this for battles that are 1850.

Blacksun filters stay on deathrains to deal with transports, not infantry.

Cheers!

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