XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Discuss tactical and strategic development for 40K/Tau.
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Arka0415
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XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#1 » Jul 14 2017 10:03

As the relentless Mathhammer gurus of ATT and other sites have found, Cyclic Ion Blasters and (maybe?) Burst Cannons appear to be the ideal weapons for XV8s with their low accuracy. Fusion Blasters and Missile Pods seem less effective, on XV8s at least. Flamers are controversial, as are Plasma Rifles, and everyone knows the AFP is pretty terrible! :P

Anyway, who has tried out XV8s in battle in 8th Edition? Does the theory hold up? Do some XV8 builds perform surprisingly well on the tabletop? Or, are there drawbacks to mathematically-viable loadouts that simple math might not reveal?

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Glarblar
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#2 » Jul 14 2017 10:22

I've played a couple XV8 loadouts and here's what I thought:

CIB:
Perfect for Manta Strike in and taking out light vehicles, 27 shots incoming is amazing

QFB commander:
Great at taking out a single tank, but then is very vulnerable be careful with him

Quad pod commander:
Nice backline support and can use him to activate kauyon/mont'ka

2xFlamer,BC
very underrated combination but make sure you take with drones for extra wounds. Excellent for advancing or charging to tie something up.
Last edited by Glarblar on Jul 14 2017 11:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Yojimbob
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#3 » Jul 14 2017 10:26

Arka0415 wrote:As the relentless Mathhammer gurus of ATT and other sites have found, Cyclic Ion Blasters and (maybe?) Burst Cannons appear to be the ideal weapons for XV8s with their low accuracy. Fusion Blasters and Missile Pods seem less effective, on XV8s at least. Flamers are controversial, as are Plasma Rifles, and everyone knows the AFP is pretty terrible! :P

Anyway, who has tried out XV8s in battle in 8th Edition? Does the theory hold up? Do some XV8 builds perform surprisingly well on the tabletop? Or, are there drawbacks to mathematically-viable loadouts that simple math might not reveal?


15 CIB's is a ton of points but it has brought down knights and LR without being shot at. Our beta strike is ultra strong with them. And I WILL have 5 lights on those units to make their points worth while. I have since modified and brought only 11 CIB's to add versatility to the squad with a VT. I opt for 3CIB rather than 2CIB+ATS because dice. Always bring more dice than the other guy. Haven't personally tried taking fewer guns to make them cheaper for the extra AP.

Very curious how flamers work out in practice though I feel like I'd lose out to much by not taking CIB's.

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Yojimbob
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#4 » Jul 14 2017 10:28

Glarblar wrote:Quad pod commander:
Nice backline support and can use him to activate kauyon/mont'ka


I can second this. Haven't tried an XV8 version yet. I feel like old Deathrain with ATS should be okish but I'm not sold on Misslepods for their price so far.

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Glarblar
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#5 » Jul 14 2017 10:51

Yojimbob wrote:Very curious how flamers work out in practice though I feel like I'd lose out to much by not taking CIB's.


They make very good shock troopers against non-elite armies. They can destroy light troops very effectively though, they can compete with Firewarriors. The auto hit does really well without markerlight support as well. While advancing they have a 16"-22" threat range

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Vector Strike
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#6 » Jul 14 2017 11:07

XV8 with 3 flamers are one of the best horde-killing unit in our arsenal. All you need is a stealth suit with a homing beacon not too far from the soon-to-be-crispy unit :crafty:

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Panzer
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#7 » Jul 14 2017 05:14

So far Crisis with CIBs, Flamer or Plasma worked the best for me.
Commander can basically run with anything except for AFP.
Burst Cannons just as in 7th always felt very underwhelming on Crisis/Commander. If you want S5 shooting at 18" take Gun Drones. Period.
Last edited by Panzer on Jul 15 2017 03:24, edited 1 time in total.

PeeJ
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#8 » Jul 14 2017 07:29

I've used 3 set ups on Crisis suits so far

QFB
3xPlasma
3xFlamer

The Plasmas never seem to do much of anything even though some people's mathhammering seems to indicate they'd have similar effectiveness as Flamers but over a much better range.

QFB is QFB

3xFlamers have had the best impact for me in games so far as a blitzkrieg unit or as backlines deep strike counters. Deploying with homing beacons. The psychological impact they have shouldn't be underestimated. When a guys tooled up melee specialists deep strike behind your lines, then get 9 auto hitting flamers land on their faces and wipe them off the board with 30+ wounds to roll saves for (without even needing the 24 S5 shots their 6 ablative wounds give them). It has a big impact and puts them off getting too close to anything anywhere near that unit. It also gives them a big decision to make - focus fire ona unit with ablative wounds that can't even shoot at them over out big scary guns, or write off melee in a potential ~40" range in your back lines.

DancinHobo
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#9 » Jul 14 2017 08:19

Duel Plasmas are my go to. I play against a lot of space marines, and plasmas cut them down relatively easy. Even against 2+ armor

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MNGamer
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#10 » Jul 15 2017 12:10

My favorite so far is 2 plasma and a flamer with the Shas getting two flamers and a drone controller. Good at taking down TEQs and the overwatch is very effective.
Even when broken, a sword may still cut~Aun'ko'vash

Finghain
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#11 » Jul 15 2017 06:01

I'm not a big fan of 3 of the same weapons on a suit from a visusal point of view, so I've been trying (or am planning to try) some 2 weapons/support system builds as well as some mixed weapons builds.

One I've used twice is a 5 suit team with 2x 2 CIB + DC/VT + 3x 2 PR/FT, accompanied by 10 Drones (8 Gun, 2 Marker). Not a cheap setup, clocking in at more that 450 points with Drones; I've used the squad in both games to support my Commanders with drones / block langes of fire to them. VT is situational but cheap, and it gives its benefit to 5 Suits, so thats nice.

3-Suit setups I want to try soon is 6 CIBs + either MTs (for overcharging without ML support) or TLs for more mobility (1 ML Hit is easy to get, 3 depending on List is a bit harder - and of you bring TLs you can bring less MLs) with 6 Gundrones - without DC more or less glorified ablative armour.

As for Commanders, 4 Weapons is obviously best, but I've had some success with 3 Weapons + TL (again, mobility) or 3 CIBs + MT for overcharging specificly. Only problem for me again is the look.

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AnonAmbientLight
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#12 » Jul 15 2017 01:55

It's still important to recognize weapon range and application when trying to figure out what weapon is best to use on the table top. The CiB might be better than the Missile Pod on paper, but the Missile Pod is far more flexible and safer in its application than the CiB is.

The real question you should be asking is what is your play style and what do you plan to do with your army? Then you must select the weapon that best suits that goal.
Sky IS Falling, T'au WILL Suck, Sell Me Your Models

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Quorgyle
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#13 » Jul 15 2017 02:29

AnonAmbientLight wrote:The real question you should be asking is what is your play style and what do you plan to do with your army? Then you must select the weapon that best suits that goal.


Dunno about you, but I'm taking weapons so that I can kill my opponents army.

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AnonAmbientLight
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#14 » Jul 15 2017 03:48

Seriously though, the point I was making is an important one.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=26056

Here's a T'au player that placed 2nd in a recent tournament. He primarily uses Flamers, Fusion, and Burst Cannons on his suits to do the job. In this case his playstyle is very aggressive and his army is tailored around that. His check list was probably something like this.

I want to play super aggressive and get in my opponent's face early. What will get me those results while also being effective? What units can help me achieve these goals? What loadouts should I take on those units? Does my list synergize with my stated goal?

He likely wasn't thinking, "What weapons have the best mathhammer?" because it all depends on what you want to do.

Here's another example. Mathhammer, according to this thread, states that CiB is worth it over most other weapons by the numbers. It's not an obvious choice though as each weapon fulfills different goals depending on what you are trying to do. For example, the CiB only has an 18in range. This means that you have to get relatively close to your opponent which makes the use of the weapon risky. It also means that alternative deployment options, such as deploying in your deployment zone, will not work because of that range. There also might be better options as well. If you're already getting that close, and risk of losing the unit with CiB is high, you might as well go all in with Fusion or Flamers.

If you don't plan on losing the unit, or need to get more shooting out of it, then a missile pod would be better. You can still get close, while also having the option to start in your deployment zone and still be effective.
Sky IS Falling, T'au WILL Suck, Sell Me Your Models

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Rogue Sun
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#15 » Jul 16 2017 01:37

I'm considering a unit of 5 with double plasma and a flamer each to use as a shock unit in a heavy deep strike list. The idea is to keep them relatively cheap but dangerous enough to draw fire and let them threaten a variety of targets. I know people are down on plasma but CIBs are expensive and more importantly hard to find.

I've seen the alternative counts as bits too and I'm rwlly not a fan of the aesthetic. Maybe I can cast a few in resin, but still seems like a pain.

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Panzer
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#16 » Jul 16 2017 01:41

Plasma are fine imo but require you to be within 12" to be worth their points so that means 6" less range than a CIB. Shouldn't matter much for an Alpha Strike unit though unless the opponent has good bubble wrap units like Kroot who can scout ahead before the game begins (and even then one could include a Homing Beacon in ones list).

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Rogue Sun
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#17 » Jul 16 2017 02:22

At that point I'd probably do a staggered drop ot a delayed drop. Or honestly not care. Much of it isn't so much about the alpha (since the vespid and commander can still hit their targets) and more about 900 points landing in your back field and sandwiching my opponent between two dangerous forces.

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Panzer
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Re: XV8s - From Theory to Tabletop

Post#18 » Jul 16 2017 10:43

Heh, dunno I usually play against armies that have enough units in their own backfield so placing reserves there is almost impossible. Only the Space Wolve player struggles with that. :D

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