The Dawnblade.... can it cut down the Monolith?

A review of Rules of Engagement from earlier encounters.
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Dethray
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The Dawnblade.... can it cut down the Monolith?

Post#1 » Mar 03 2006 02:33

After reading the new Codex rules for O'shovah, I have a question: can the Dawnblade cut down the Monolith?

In the previous Tau Codex, O'shovah rolls 2D6+S to penetrate vehicles as he was a Monstrous Creature.

The new rule simply states that he rolls 2D6+S.

The Monolith "Living Metal" rule in the FAQ update ignores extra dice and scores.

Should the Dawnblade be considered to have an extra dice for penetrating vehicles, even though the codex doesn't say so? Take for instance, the only thing that can work, according to the Necron FAQ is the turbo penetrator round, which has XD6 penetration, period. The Dawnblade is also 2D6+S, period. Based on this analogy, I think our renegade commander do have a chance against the Necron Monolith. Your thoughts?

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Orange-Bell
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Post#2 » Mar 03 2006 03:29

Nope absolutely no chance.

The monolith rules clearly states basic strength +1d6, i really don't think this would be an exception. I think they only stated it like that because the old 'counts as monstrous creature' thing was ambiguous.

O-B
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Dethray
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Post#3 » Mar 03 2006 03:33

Orange-Bell wrote:Nope absolutely no chance.

The monolith rules clearly states basic strength +1d6, i really don't think this would be an exception. I think they only stated it like that because the old 'counts as monstrous creature' thing was ambiguous.

O-B


I need to know where you got the "basic strength + 1d6" statment from, I cannot find it in the Necron FAQ. Similarly, won't the turbo penetrator won't work based on this? Since it is only D6 instead of XD6 for armour penetration? Correct me if I am wrong...

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Post#4 » Mar 03 2006 03:39

its how roles for hit work with vehicles, but in the monos case things like Mont Creatures and melta weapons don't get Str+2D6 its now only str+D6 like everything else.

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Dethray
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Post#5 » Mar 03 2006 04:02

Vermiculatus wrote:its how roles for hit work with vehicles, but in the monos case things like Mont Creatures and melta weapons don't get Str+2D6 its now only str+D6 like everything else.


What bothers me now is that Farsight is no longer Monstrous in close combat. So his 2D6+S should not count as bonus penetration.

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Evil Ben
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Post#6 » Mar 03 2006 06:08

Dethray wrote:I need to know where you got the "basic strength + 1d6" statment from, I cannot find it in the Necron FAQ. Similarly, won't the turbo penetrator won't work based on this? Since it is only D6 instead of XD6 for armour penetration? Correct me if I am wrong...


I shall quote from the Sacred Text, Necron FAQ v4.0.1, Monolith, 7th Verse:
"When attacking a Monolith, extra penetration dice and
doubling scores are much the same thing-don't count
any bonus penetration of any sort against a Monolith.
So no bonuses for multiple Talos attacks, tank-hunter
veteratn skills, etc. The only exception is the Vindicare
Assassins' turbo-enetrator round. As this shell is not
bonus penetration as such, it will work. Note that you
still roll 2D6 and pick the higher when attacking a Monolith
with ordnance weapons"

There it is in all its glory, bad grammer, misspellings and all.

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Dethray
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Post#7 » Mar 03 2006 07:04

Evil Ben wrote:
Dethray wrote:I need to know where you got the "basic strength + 1d6" statment from, I cannot find it in the Necron FAQ. Similarly, won't the turbo penetrator won't work based on this? Since it is only D6 instead of XD6 for armour penetration? Correct me if I am wrong...


I shall quote from the Sacred Text, Necron FAQ v4.0.1, Monolith, 7th Verse:
"When attacking a Monolith, extra penetration dice and
doubling scores are much the same thing-don't count
any bonus penetration of any sort against a Monolith.
So no bonuses for multiple Talos attacks, tank-hunter
veteratn skills, etc. The only exception is the Vindicare
Assassins' turbo-enetrator round. As this shell is not
bonus penetration as such, it will work. Note that you
still roll 2D6 and pick the higher when attacking a Monolith
with ordnance weapons"

There it is in all its glory, bad grammer, misspellings and all.


That's where my question comes. It says bonus penetration. In the Tau Codex, it just says his Dawnblade has an armour penetration of 2d6+S, with no indication that it is a bonus at all.

Tallen
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Post#8 » Mar 03 2006 10:17

The standard roll for penetration when using your basic strength is S+D6. Anything more than that D6 is considered a "bonus," hence the use of the word "bonus" to mean "extra," "additional," or what have you.

Vermiculatus
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Post#9 » Mar 03 2006 11:45

i think the reason they dropped MC status from him was so that he couldnt be targeted in his squad of 7 XV8's or/and he could have IC status now

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The Mighty Qu'in
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Post#10 » Mar 03 2006 11:47

He always could. Hr just counted as an MC in combat

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Post#11 » Mar 03 2006 11:52

your right i never used him, but i thought there was some reason i heard...

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T0nkaTruckDriver
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Post#12 » Mar 03 2006 12:23

The reason they dropped the MC status is because they didn't want him counting as 10 models in Close Combat.

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5thstreet
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Post#13 » Mar 03 2006 01:16

Why does GW go through so much trouble to avoid calling the Dawn Blade a "power weapon"?

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A neutral shade of black.
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Post#14 » Mar 03 2006 01:33

T0nkaTruckDriver wrote:The reason they dropped the MC status is because they didn't want him counting as 10 models in Close Combat.


In other words, they didn't want him to be remotely good at what he's supposed to do.

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Shas'el Tur'in
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Post#15 » Apr 12 2006 05:43

Everyone keeps saying Farsight does "2D6+S" damage versus vehicles...

Is my Empires codex the ONLY one that says it does "2D6+5" damage?

Sure, Farsight's Strength is also 5, but the Special Rule entry for the Dawn Blade says, "...No Armour Saves may be taken from hits caused by the dawn blade and O'Shovah rolls 2D6+5 when rolling to penetrate the armour of a vehicle."

It says nothing about this being any sort of bonus to his existing strength, and no dice are added to the normal attack; 2D6+5 IS the normal attack of the Dawn Blade.

Another interesting part of these rules is the mention of "...No Armour Saves may be taken from hits caused by the dawn blade..." This says to me that not even Invulnerable saves are safe, although I don't want to go into the "are Invulnerable saves the same as Armour Saves" debate.

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Fugu
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Post#16 » Apr 12 2006 05:50

Shas'el Tur'in wrote:Another interesting part of these rules is the mention of "...No Armour Saves may be taken from hits caused by the dawn blade..." This says to me that not even Invulnerable saves are safe, although I don't want to go into the "are Invulnerable saves the same as Armour Saves" debate.


Yer poking at a snake with a stick ;-)
Pretend inferiority and encourage his arrogance.

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GodHead
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Post#17 » Apr 12 2006 05:52

Also note that the Vindicare Assassins Turbo-Penetrator round is granted a specific exemption from Living Metal in the Necron FAQ. The wording for the Turbo-Penetrator Round?

If fired at a vehicle, the shot has an Armour Penetration value of 3D6.


The wording for Farsight?

O'Shovah rolls 2D6+5 when rolling to penetrate the armour of a vehicle.


The wording for Bio-Acid Spore mines?

Bio-Acid Spore Mines roll 2D6+3 to penetrate vehicle armour.


None of these are bonuses, none of these use the strength of the attack, only the Turbo-Penetrator round existed at the time of the FAQ.

I'd vote that each of these would have full effect against the Monolith, as they all function in a similar way.

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Flashman
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Post#18 » Apr 12 2006 06:29

Shas'el Tur'in wrote:...Another interesting part of these rules is the mention of "...No Armour Saves may be taken from hits caused by the dawn blade..." This says to me that not even Invulnerable saves are safe, although I don't want to go into the "are Invulnerable saves the same as Armour Saves" debate.


Yeah that's my favourite. The really confusing thing is the words invulnerable and armour. I mean their like the same word or... thing. Ya kno, so they're the same. Do you see?
#43 formally known as El' & yes I still come here

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