sweeping advance? why will no one believe me at my store?!?

A review of Rules of Engagement from earlier encounters.
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staticelf
Shas
Posts: 16

sweeping advance? why will no one believe me at my store?!?

Post#1 » Mar 05 2006 01:59

How can some people argue with the rule book?!?
:-? Ok need some back up on this one!...get charged by a Dark Eldar Lord who kills four of my Fire Warriors...so logicaly I want to kill him with my other warrior squad that is 5" away so I take all four from the front taking the warriors out of base to base with the Lord...So I can't strike back...but if I lose my morale check and run...(which I do) then he can only consolidate normally instead of sweeping advance as per the rule book pg.43

"If the falling back unit no longer has any models in base contact with with the victor, or if the victor has models still engaged in combat with other units which are not falling back, the victor does not get a chance to sweeping advance, but may still consolidate."

which I show him...still he will not accept this and says Im bending the rules in my favor by doing this and that im taking it out of context with the 'spirit of the rule' but he can not show me any other instance where this would come into question and definently will not set down to read the book himself and keeps repeating 'your reading it wrong! your reading it wrong!' so after threatening to just quit the game I give in which I feel was wrong of me because now that I let him think he is right no one at my store will let me use a tactic which is clearly (at least i seems to me to be!) stated! So please enlighten me if I am reading this incorrectly, or somehow taking it out of context. Thanks! (Stomped him good after he failed his d6 to get into combat with the next squad and won the game after all his whining anyways! :evil: Kroot kill witches good! :biggrin: )

Thenlar
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Posts: 15

Post#2 » Mar 05 2006 02:11

You are completely correct. That is all. :D

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UN17
Shas
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Contact:

Post#3 » Mar 05 2006 02:12

The words are in clear English. There is no room for doubt since you followed the rules for removing models and for the Sweeping Advance requiring base contact with a fleeing unit to be successful. At least you finished the game and next time, don't play him anymore until he learns to read.

nowrush
Shas
Posts: 98

Post#4 » Mar 05 2006 02:22

The fact that your opponent absolutely refuses to read the rule book should tell you all that you need to know!! If this occurs again, make up a rule, such as "Tau automatically wins all shooting phases", and then refuse to look at the rule book when he tries to prove you wrong.

Alternatively, you can say "Tau automatically wins all shooting phases", and challenge him to prove you wrong. When he says "Your rule appears nowhere in the book", challenge him to point out the specific rule that says "Tau does NOT always win all shooting phases". That should be a chuckle and a half!

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staticelf
Shas
Posts: 16

I just hate those that wont listen

Post#5 » Mar 05 2006 02:58

Im sure in the end he saw it as me trying to use the rules to maximise my effictiveness...which is how you play the game correct? But that of course in turn hurts his army by keeping him from accomplishing his planned sweep into the next squad so that I win by rapid firing him back to hell and holding the loot counter so i guess he thought he could argue that this was bogus regardless of what that crazy book I had said...it is a fair move that he still gets what he intended but with out the advantage for him of the sweeping advance (my boys still run away like panzies with little hope of regrouping) and in reality one that I rarely get to use because close combat usually is vs. 30 tyranid or so...not just a terminator base sized Dark Eldar lord....so it is a lot harder to get out of base to base with 30 models while easy with just one!...so that is a reason this rule is not well know or seen I think...so for those of you out there spread this around and make it known please so that we wont run into this as often! I now may start showing a person this rule before a game so that in the heat of the battle they don't erroneously call bull...but it shouldnt be this way!
( oh and this is just my pet peave thing...if we make war with guns not close combat weapons in 2006 why do they start using them again 40,000yrs in the future! If you want to punch or stab something play fantasy except maybe for you tyranids out there...its hard to hold a gun with a talon for a hand but that doesnt mean you can't grow one right! ;)

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Orange-Bell
Por'O
Por'O
Posts: 931

Post#6 » Mar 05 2006 11:27

This is a really common tactic in my area. The disdvantage of this tactic is that you will always lose, and never strike back. But with non-CC armies this is usually a advantage.

Tell him to toughen up! ;)

O-B
O-B

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Markerlite
Shas
Posts: 232

Re: I just hate those that wont listen

Post#7 » Mar 09 2006 06:08

staticelf wrote:...not just a terminator base sized Dark Eldar lord....


And this tiny comment in the middle of your post explains exactly the type of guy you were playing... any idea why he had a terminator sized base? it looks nice... he's my armies focal point... i wanted hi to stand out from the rest...
More likely it's becasue he engages more models in combat and so can kill more!!!!!

Don't relent with people like this... at least he got his come uppance....
Markerlite
(The beer that always hits home)

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Evil Ben
Shas
Posts: 20

Re: I just hate those that wont listen

Post#8 » Mar 09 2006 07:55

staticelf wrote:( oh and this is just my pet peave thing...if we make war with guns not close combat weapons in 2006 why do they start using them again 40,000yrs in the future!


The US Marine Corp practices close combat to the point that
they are issued different colored belts based on the level of
martial training they've completed. Of course, it is also rank
based, so that E-3 can't get a belt level than an E-5....

Since my brother was in the 'Corps he sends me articles about
Marines, and I can tell you that several of the articles he sent
me about our adventures in Iraq and Afganistan were about
the Marines engaging the enemy in close combat.

But then that's Marines. Now the Army pukes, they probably just
shoot...
Your species needs to learn its place. ~Saren

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Senexis
Shas
Posts: 69

Post#9 » Mar 09 2006 08:48

The minute he refused to read the rule I would have called the game. It's a GAME. You're both supposed to have FUN.

Did this once with a good friend, who just wouldn't budge. We saw things differently - genuinely - and I suggested rolling 4+ to settle it and then discuss later. He wouldn't, so I packed up the game.

It's a tough memory, because it was the last time I ever saw him (he died a few months later) and a sour note to end things on, but it was the only way. And if I had the time over, I'd probably not play him.

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P'Shar's Rifles
Kor'O
Kor'O
Posts: 2041

Re: I just hate those that wont listen

Post#10 » Mar 09 2006 12:41

Evil Ben wrote:
staticelf wrote:( oh and this is just my pet peave thing...if we make war with guns not close combat weapons in 2006 why do they start using them again 40,000yrs in the future!

But then that's Marines. Now the Army pukes, they probably just
shoot...


Yeah, the Army has discovered that opposable thumbs allow the use of tools. ;)

Thenlar
Shas
Posts: 15

Post#11 » Mar 09 2006 01:43

Well, while we're threadjacking...

What does ARMY stand for? Aren't Ready for Marines Yet!

Why is it an Army of One? Because everyone else ran away!

Oo-rah!

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I've had some rules disputes with my friends over issues like these before, and the roll of the die 1-3: Your way, 4-6: My way has never failed to resolve the issue, at least for the duration of the game. A person who isn't even willing to do that is completely unwilling to compromise, and frankly, those are the kind of people that cause problems. Compromise is the only way people get anything done in a world where everyone has their own opinion. If that kind of thing happened, I agree with what you did. Pack up and leave, and hell, I'd never play a game with him again.

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staticelf
Shas
Posts: 16

Sorry fellas but Im with the army side

Post#12 » Mar 09 2006 01:49

Being an army lieutenant with a marine father I am split in my love for corps and sane logical warfare...trust me most of them are blood thirsty psychos...I flew a lot of them in my Chinook and all they talk about is 'yeah it was so cool when i shot that guy in the spine!' :eek:

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P'Shar's Rifles
Kor'O
Kor'O
Posts: 2041

Agreed.

Post#13 » Mar 09 2006 02:36

Absolutely. If reason fails, rules references fail, and they won't even dice off for it, pack up your toys and go elsewhere. Simply having people refuse to play with him will change someone's tune faster than arguing with him.

Off-topic: In my family my dad's retired Navy, mom's retired Army Reserve, one uncle was Merchant Marine, father-in-law is retired Air Force. Imagine the family gatherings... :D

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The Professor
Shas
Posts: 119

Re: Agreed.

Post#14 » Mar 09 2006 04:04

P'Shar's Rifles wrote:In my family my dad's retired Navy, mom's retired Army Reserve, one uncle was Merchant Marine, father-in-law is retired Air Force. Imagine the family gatherings... :D


Just join the Marines and watch them get a lot more... interesting :evil:

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