Necrons

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Mawz34
Shas
Posts: 5

Necrons

Post#1 » Jan 16 2014 02:04

Hey ATT

So I've just started collecting the awesomeness of the Tau.
And my primary opponent is going to be necrons.
So i know in my opponent pretty much has everything in the necron arsenal.

My biggest fear is dealing with monoliths and their 14 armor my second fear is dealing with borders hordes of gauss infantry

My idea ifs to use rail heads against the monolith iS either Railheads or melta suits

Then the hordes I plan To out Range them with fire warriors

But me being new to tau I'm not a seasoned veteran and would appreciate some input.

Please and thank you

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DaceKhan
Shas
Posts: 42

Re: Necrons

Post#2 » Jan 16 2014 02:55

You may be tempted by Longstrike, he's a good thing against AV 13/14, but remember one of the hardest things for necrons to deal with is Riptides, they're only good counters are Deathmarks and Mindshackle scarabs (which with planning, can be avoided). So personally I believe a Ion/Fusion Riptide is amazing.

But yea if not a riptide, then Longstrike, or fusion suits, broadsides are also pretty good even with missiles as most necron shots are S7 so the broadsides can take a few hits, and broadsides weight of shots can glance most necron vehicles to death.
Until all are one

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De'terra
Fio'Vre
Posts: 554

Re: Necrons

Post#3 » Jan 16 2014 03:06

Greetings Mawz34,

First off, welcome to our little corner on the internet!
I really really hate to do this but your post is severly lacking in substance.
That may come off as harsh but bear with me.

You are new, you have no experience with Tau and so you value our input. Which is fine! That is what we are here for.
The way that you ask it can be improved. Your current post simply states "how to beat necrons?" No further information.
We can continue and have 4 to 5 posts with questions for information and then maybe.. maybe we can have a constructive answer in about a week and 2 pages of this thread.

I have taken a look at your member profile and there you have posted that you bought a battleforce, Devilfish, 2th team of Fire warriors and a Broadside. Is that still valid? Do you have any other models at your disposal?
We can suggest lists and units for you to use but if you do not have the models, that will not benefit you.

Furthermore, our Codex is extremely versatile. I really can't think of a combination of units that wouldn't be able to put the hurt on any army. So tell us, what would you like to play? You may be new but you must have read some of the fluff. Did you like the armoured assaults? Hordes of fast skimmers? a wave of battlesuits? or do you like the unexpected approach of the XV-25?

But wait! There is more. I see you have played some games already. What is your point level for the moment? If you have a regular opponent with Necrons, what does he usually field? Which of those units is his lynchpin? What part of his army is giving you grief or do you not know how to tackle?
It is a bit of a long list but that is the nature of the our complicated game :)
With all that info you can expect some of the best tactical response on the internet. Afterall, you can only expect to receive what you give.

Besides that, there is also the search function. Just 3 posts down from this one: viewtopic.php?f=57&t=21517
That post has suffered the same issue as I described earlier. I can certainly understand that his problem is not the same as yours but you could just get some inspiration from that discussion.

On a different note, reading a battle report is also excellent to pick up a few tricks.
Just head on over to that section, the first page has 3 necron reports in it.

Take a moment to process it, gather your thoughts and enable us to help you.
I'll keep this thread in mind in the hopes of offering some advice later on.

Tau'Va!

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Ma'lek
Shas
Posts: 24

Re: Necrons

Post#4 » Jan 16 2014 07:29

Hello my fellow Sash'saal!

You haven't given us much to go on here. You say he has everything available to him from the Necron range, but does that also include Forge World? Does he use the standard list or the Forge World list?

As it is, I felt this would be a good place for me to post as I have a decade of experience with the Necrons, being my first army. I can only really give you very general advice when playing against them without any idea of what he usually uses in his games. So I will do as such, however if you could come back with at least a general idea of what he utilises in his games I and other more venerable warriors of the Greater Good can chip in with much clearer and specific advice.

The first point I will make about Necrons is that they are tough. Their Reanimation Protocol special rule states that if even a single member of a unit with the rule survives they can take a 5+ reanimation save, bringing them back from the dead. This can be augmented by Ressurection Orbs to 4+, and even Warriors that fail can be brought back through the use of Ghost Arks. All this combined with a profile almost on par with a Space Marine makes them very hard to send back to their tombs. To deal with this, the best advice I can give you is to concentrate fire. Focus everything on wiping out one unit at a time, as to not do so allows those units to Reanimate, and in the case of Warriors supported by Ghost Arks to regenerate D3 a turn that have already been lost. They cannot take this reanimation save nor the Ghost Arks Repair if you wipe out the unit.

The second key point I'd like to make regarding the Necrons is one the Tau are in the best position to exploit. The Necrons are a force that has comparable firepower to Tau, some would argue that the Gauss rule makes them even better. They do have one glaring weakness, and that being the range of their guns. You can count on one hand all of their guns that have a range of over 24". These few weapons are very expensive to bring to the table (Heavy Destroyers, Doomsday Arks, and Cryptek weapons), and are thus rarely seen. Tau can stay out of their rapid fire range and still put out a considerable amount of firepower of their own. Stay out of their range (30-19") and keep moving Shas'saal! Units in Devilfish skimmers, Crisis Suits, ext. as these can all stay well out of their range and still be very effective.

Outside of this, I cannot give you more. When you come back with a rough outline of what he brings to the table, I can be vastly more specific.

Kind regards,
a fellow Sash'saal.
My love of rolling 1's knows no bounds.

Syndathim
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Re: Necrons

Post#5 » Jan 16 2014 11:46

I can't add much more to this thread then what has already been discussed but I will re-iterate that annihilating one enemy squad at a time is the best course of action against the Necrons. I have a lot of fun fighting them purely as I have to dance my units around the table to avoid their fire power and close combat units.

A lot of Necron players seem to loath using Flayed Ones which in brutal honesty are the best units to use against Gunline Tau as far as I can see. Long may that trend continue.
Never Surrender Dreams.

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Ma'lek
Shas
Posts: 24

Re: Necrons

Post#6 » Jan 16 2014 11:57

Syndathim wrote:I can't add much more to this thread then what has already been discussed but I will re-iterate that annihilating one enemy squad at a time is the best course of action against the Necrons. I have a lot of fun fighting them purely as I have to dance my units around the table to avoid their fire power and close combat units.

A lot of Necron players seem to loath using Flayed Ones which in brutal honesty are the best units to use against Gunline Tau as far as I can see. Long may that trend continue.


Actually they're pretty damn rubbish in comparison to a unit of Wraiths. Slow, with the resilience of a standard Warrior, the only way to get them into a threatening position is to Infiltrate them, where they cannot then assault. Wraiths are faster, incredibly resilient, with lots of Rending attacks at a high strength (6) that will cause Instant-Death on Fire Warriors/Pathfinders, ext.

If they were Troops Flayed Ones may be considered, but they're Elites. Elites are the Cron's weakest section, but everything in there is stronger than Flayed Ones. The Forge World list does have them down as Troops, so in this they may receive a boost in popularity. It is a shame, their models are beautiful.

Tau can easily deal with them through 'Missilesides,' which have Smart Missiles that don't require LoS. Dealing with Wraiths with a T4, W3, 3+ & 3++ save is much more difficult.
My love of rolling 1's knows no bounds.

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Mawz34
Shas
Posts: 5

Re: Necrons

Post#7 » Jan 16 2014 01:29

You know what thank you all for the input i appreciate it and your all right my inexperience shows through this thread and im sorry i it came across as eating your time. But i see i need to do more research and learn the codex more and really analyze my opponents play Style, let alone i need to decide which art of war style i want to follow. Again iappreciate all the help, advice,and input.

*future not don't post anything from my phone internet again*

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Myrdin
Shas
Posts: 403

Re: Necrons

Post#8 » Feb 25 2014 06:39

Hey there.

I´ve been lurking this forum for some time, but this would be the very first post, but seeing as i play against necrons on frequent basis, here is some insight that you might find (or not) useful.
**also if it happens, and i unintentionally write something from the rules that can cause a problem for this site, i apologize, in that case please mods change that if necessarily.

//The usual necron power build is 4 flyers, and 3 units of 6 wraiths. I will not cover this, due the fact that i don't usually face this xxxx as my opponent is not a tard and we want to enjoy a good fun game, not one sided slaughter.//

As for the possible threats, here is a short summary. This is by no way a deep insight, just a few points to one can expect from the Necrons in the usual common build (no mega fun, nor super competative). Also bear in mind - i am not comparing units and items with other units and items from different armies. That would take way too long and its not in the intention of this post:

Destrotects - can hurt a lot, all that S9 shooting can instakill most of your units, and even chop down your Riptide eventually. One friend of mine runs 2 all the time, the other one wants a 5 man destro star deployed in the Bastion as far as possible to get you into range.
Now these guys are Necrotects soo it is not that hard to strip them of their save and chop them down with some shooting, but they are cheap, and can have some interesting equipment... also they are kinda weird as they are technically sergeants, bit better then your common infantry, but still not up the par with the Overlord himself. But don't underestimate these guys. Its the utility and load-out options that make them shine

Overall values - Necrons have overall quite decent Armor values, and tough vehicles due to the shield thingy. A great thing to have all the time is a unit of 3 Broadsides with HYMP. Now these guys are TL which is already awesome. If you run a support, or semi support Commander with the Puretide Neurochip, this guys get Tank hunter - and 12 rerollable S7 shots WILL glance anything to death.
If you go full support Com. you ignore any cover/jink saves. If not force at least 2 markerlights on that vehicle (best thing is 3, one for BS one for no cover). Bum dead truck.

Speed - Another thing to consider - necrons by themself are slow, and have mostly only 24" range. That gives you some advantage. Soo don't deploy too close, go as far as possible to keep some way to maneuver but let him close the gap.
If your oponent runs mass scarabs or Wraiths be watchfull of those - they are very fast and can be up your face turn 2 if your are not carefull. They can take a lot of pain if you don't have the right fire power (temlate, blasts vs scarabs, mass fire against Wraiths), A good way around is to have one suicide suit with flamers, on standby against scarabs, or a Cadre Fireblade is great to pump out those shots, while your heavy hitters do the real killing.

Flyers - now this is something you will have to deal with. Necron flyers are cheap, and great for their points. No they are no Vendettas or such, but they can fly in fast, in good numbers, and drop down those deathmarks, immortal, warriors in your own lines. If that happens you most likely lost. Try to get them down when they appear. It takes usually 2 turns for them to get to you, so don't focus on them that much and neglect the rest, but try to get them.
Great thing is the Aegis Defense Line with Quad Gun, viable to all races (even the new Nids wueej :D ). I run Aegis with Quad Gun ALL the time, simply because its soo amazing at the points for what it does. Depending on how heavy flyer he is, you can go either Skyrai, or get Skyfire for your Riptide
(sure Broadside can have it to, and are amazing but.... do you really wanna commint those 20/40/60 pts for just that upgrade ? makes them very expensive and a tasty kill point for your enemy to claim).

Necron saves and reanimation - The big thing that makes Necrons competative. Their reanimation protocols. Basically what this does - a unit that has not been completely wiped out, can roll a die for every "dead" model in that unit. On a good roll these models stand up and join the unit. Sounds scary ? It is.... There are many ways to enhance this, with equipment, or a Ghost Arc, that can even "heal" the -dead,dead- models successfully bolstering their numbers back to their original state.
If you shoot at necrons, don't do it halfheartedly - finish the job if possible, no matter the amount of shoting. Or you might find out that the one guy left standing is back to his 10 unit, and this time it is him who is dishing out the pain. You wipe them all out, they wont stand back. Now its good to Focus Fire, even with your heavy hitters, but again, you need to evaluate - what should fire first, and what will do what kind of damage. Is it worth shooting last man standing with your 12 missiles ? Yes it is if there is nothing else to shoot at (rarely), or if its the thing that might earn you the First blood.

As for the Characters- they are much meaner. Not only they have enhanced reanimation, they are also independent from their unit. What it means: if you kill the unit with the character completely, the unit is gone, but the character may still roll his die and stand back up.
And there are not that many scary things, than when you advance a bit, and suddenly a close combat kitted necron Lord stand back up behind your back. Even if you take him down - if possible, pull your closest units away from him. Because he can repeat this indefinitely, until he finally fails and dies. In one of my games, a Necron Overlord reanimated 3-4 times in a row. He slowly crawled closer and closer each time, soaking crazy amount of shooting with his 2+ save. Finally he failed in the fifth round, and stayed dead.... pfuuf

What to do ? - Basically the best thing to do against necrons - FOCUS FIRE FOCUS FIRE FOCUS FIRE. His units are hard to take down, due to the Reanimation protocols. Its a chance, but he can get back 1-2 guys or he can get the whole unit (once i killed 9 of 10 man squad.... he reanimated 7 of them on 5+.... so yeah...). Never spread out too much. Let two three units focus one of his own down, then go for the next one. Use your heavy hitters to dish the pain elsewhere in the mean time (enemy vehicles or mass units, and drop fire or templates, blasts, etc on them) but don't be afraid to use them to finish the job, if there is no other viable target. Even if you had to shoot 12 missiles from your broadsides on that lone Necron Immortal, by all means do it, if there is no better target, or face the possibility of half of his unit standing up again and shooting those Tesla guns your way.

Bodycount - necrons are not super expensive and get a decent amount of Wounds on the table, especially with Wraiths and Scarab swarms. You should always have at least 3 units of troop choices, (i started to opt. for 4 simply because a good player will focus those troops). Its not really about wiping the table with your enemy, its about surviving longer then he is, while maintaining the strategic units (troops) to claim objectives, and deny the same to your opponent. And its really hard to outlive Necrons, so get those bodies on the table, and try to avoid easy kills like pathfinders (weak save, one wound, expensive). There are many TL weapons, support-signature systems, and OTHER Marker lights in our army, that are harder to kill.
I love pathfinders, but a good player will focus them first, so always have something that can fill in that role, and let them be just a lure, with few rounds of laser pointing, never depend on them (pathfinders) entirely.

Shooting - Now Necron shooting .... is a funny thing you see. I will not compare it etc, this post is not about that. I will say what it can do and what to avoid. Mostly they are limited in range. 24" and 12" for rapid fire. Not soo terrible, especially since you are a Tau. Now they have some nasties in there.
First would be the Tesla weaponry. It is dependent on a good roll. But this game is dependent on it anyway so... Tesla weapons can potentially get a mass volley of fire due to the rule that multiplies any successful hit of 6 into two extra wounds (thus you get your first shot, and +2 extra dices for Wounding rolls).
Next is the longe range "artillery" of the Necrons - the Beam of Death hehe - this, if successful will draw a line, all in that line suffers a powerfull high S hit. Very deadly for vehicles, elite infantry, and suits. But it aint that dependable.
Flamers - the characters can take this awesome thing for low point cost - what it does - it is an S8 flamer that wounds on your LD value ! (tau are generally LD 7) and no, its not the LD of the leader, but the profile LD of the unit. This can wipe out units like magic.
Destro staff - this thing is nasty. Its a single shot a bit better than the one our Broadsides deal. Great for instakilling our suits, characters, and sniping vehicles.

Bum...headshot ! - Now this is very controversial unit in the Necron department. Technically they are sniper.... but get only 24" range. Whats weird Kroot too have only 24" range.... well these guys not only cost multiple times more, they are not a troop either. That aside though - the Deathmarks can be very very deadly in certain builds. Outside of the sniper rifle, they have an awesome ability which sinergies are just crazy. One unit of Deathmark may mark on of opponents unit, that unit is always wounded on 2+. This not only works when another unit of DM. shoots at that same unit, but also works for any character that has joined them - yes folks, you heard me. That guy with his low AP flamer just got much better. They can get a flying transport, or Deep Strike into your territory. Overall these guys are dangerous. There was one build with 3 of them, having a flamer necrotect in each unit, all of them in flying transport. Marking 3 different units yet they get zig zag this benefit between them. If left unattended, they may mark your troops, or elite infantry guys, get close and just blast you to oblivion.
If you see a flyer that has Deathmarks in them, or you see them ready for Deep Strike in your opponents reserves, plan ahead and be prepared to deal with them when they arrive. Interceprtor Broadsided are a great asset in this manner. don't underestimate them, no matter how small the unit appears to be.

Close Combat - Necrons have some nasty tasty close combat. The best being the Wraiths, and Scarab Swarms. Wraiths are overall good, at reaping infantry, elite infantry or monstrous creatures. Scarabs shine as fast distraction, that can Literally tear your tanks apart, strip your units of armor saves and - as the name states - swarm all over you with many Wounds to soak up any retaliation. They can also use the Flayed Ones from Outflank. These can put a lot of pain, but you don't normally see this as, you cannot assault in the same turn you pop out. But still its a choice. Then there is the Scythe lord, and his pose. This is nasty High Strength, AP1 hitting. Do not let get him close....


"Shard" of C´Than - The mighty Star Gods, who bring fear into hearts of mortals and daemons alike ! Destroyer of worlds, star drinkers, and an insane unit to deal with...... but not in this edition though.
ah... and yes the C´than... but in this current book he is a joke... and doesnt have to be take really serriously as it is more than possible you will not see him unless the person REALLY wants to field him. Still though, its a monstrous creature with 4+ invul save, soo try not to get up to close just in case.
That being said - he has some good equipment options, though most of them are ment for close combat. He is slow, and costs a lot of points - thus he almost never sees the table. But if he gets into combat he can usually hold his own. Still it is not the same crazy thing as it was in the previous edition, where the C´than was just insane.
He has a single 4+ save, and a bit higher T, but same as with all units of this type - just swarm him with shooting. Either let your S7 missile, take a chunk of him, or let him get close and them rapid fire him with all the Fire warriors and Storm of Fire Ethereal.
Necrons are not the best CC army in the game, but they are universal, and thanks to that they can dish out some pain in combat as well, unlike the Tau, and live to tell the tale, so always keep an eye out for his combat specialist units, and get them before they get to you.

Monolith - this thing... I dunno. Back then you would see two of these all the time, but now... well. Its not bad, can dish out some pain, it can live through lot of a punishment, and has some neat skills to pull of (Gate of Eternity, Phasing in units, etc.) It is expensive, but whats most important - it deep strikes, and with current rules, it can misshap and you might loose it, or it may end up somewhere else. Not really worth the points, unless you know your oponent does not have the sufficient firepower to bring it down, or your army is tailored to fit in with the Monolith.
Still can be pretty scary though, mostly due to the psychological effect it has when it appears on the table, rather for what it does.

Named Characters - some cool stuff in there but, i don't want to go too deep into these, as i am in no hurry to break some rules this site might have, and with named chars. analisys you always need to go through each one in details. That said i will add this: They are good, almost all of them have a little something that makes them shine, and are deffinitely worth the points (some more some less.). If facing one of these, always let your opponent tell you all he can do before the game starts, unless you want a neat surprise in the middle of the game ;)

Oh... and if possible - try to get his Lord down - most of the necrons run the Mindshackle scarabs, and if that gets to your Riptide or something else, it will hurt you a lot (but if that happens, something has already gone terribly wrong).

Not sure if my post is of any value, but i just wanted to share a little of my experience, as i too have to deal with Necrons awfully lot of times.... Necrons as opponents are ... frustrating. They just keep getting up after you shoot them.
If you need a change of pace, go kill som IG, Orks, Eldar, or other Tau. Not soo hard to kill and once you shoot them, they stay dead :D
CHeers

PS: Its a good idea to watch some Battle Reports on Youtube that show a Tau - Necron fight (though its always good to watch other armies as well - Knowing your enemy is the first step to Victory).

Please refrain from using red in your posts, as it is generally reserved for Moderator use only. That said; good posting Shas'saal! :)
~Por'vre Tier.
Last edited by Myrdin on Feb 25 2014 11:41, edited 2 times in total.

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Kael'yn
Fio'Ui
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Re: Necrons

Post#9 » Feb 25 2014 10:36

Just to add something to Myrdin (good post about necrons, may be a thread start about this particular foes)

C'tan have a nasty power against our Riptide/shielded commanders, ... : the initiative roll CC attack (Arrow of Time or something like that). Don't think about a riptide/shield commander to tie-in a C'tan with that power unless you have a good initiative ...

It lacks too the review of the new Lord of War C'tan and Monolith, because you may face them too.
Monolith, if present, can be brought down not by railgun (one solid shot is hazardeous), but most probably by dual fusion blasters (have always one or two ready to strike to get rid of the quantum armor (+2 AV) on vehicles rapidly too).

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Myrdin
Shas
Posts: 403

Re: Necrons

Post#10 » Feb 25 2014 11:33

So after a little thinking, i decided to come back and cover a bit of the units, that are present in the codex but don't see much table.
Again this is not a full breakdown, on the Necron codex, just a short summary of "what to expect".

Also, honorable Water Caste member Por'vre Tier, thank you for your wise advise :)

The Fancy and shiny stuff - Lychguard and Triarch Praetorians. This is probably the saddest unit of all in the Necron rulebook.
They have awesome models, look really great, both on the table and on the paper but.... they suck... Not due to the fact that they by themselves would be that terrible, though not super extra great either. Its simply due the Matt Ward thingy - that some super OP things in the book cast a huge shadow on these guys (Wraith and Scarabs).
What to expect though - Both of them have nice stats, a point tougher than Immortals, with higher strength puts them on the same level as characters. The Lychguard have fancy invul save shields, that allows them on the roll of a dice throw any shot back at the enemy (limited by range though) without suffering a wound. The Praetorians have a very nice AP2 weapon that can also shot (though only suckish 6").
The problem with these guys, is their cost. They each have just a single wound, yet cost soo much you will never take them unless you want to. They are a gimmicky zombie version of the Terminators, but they don't do so well. They die to fast and cost too much. Also both of them are heavy oriented on combat.... the only way for them to get there is via deepstriking near the enemy, or getting a transport vehicle. Even soo they may not attack in the same round the disembark or deep strike. You focus them down, they die quite fast. Sniper drones especially like to shoot at them.

The Overlooked stuff - Triarch Stalker and Canoptec Spider. I have seen only one of these, that being the Stalker, and that was also only few times. Soo what we have here. Both of them are vehicles. Instead of weakness lets look what they can do.
Now the Triarch Stalker is quite odd one - at his disposal he has a nasty, yet not torrent, template, and a very powerful melta shot. You think fusion blasters are strong ? Well this guy has the range of 24" of AP1 melta. Now thats scary right ? It is, but the problem with him is, that you can kill him, and with quite the ease. To add the salt to the injury - he is open topped, so once you put some good AP weapons to use, he will more likely than not blow. Also he is quite the investment as well.
Why take him then ? IF you really need that utility, he can make use of his special rule - If this guy shots at a unit, and manages at least ONE hit, all other units shooting at the same unit, are treated as if they had Twin Linked weaponry. Now thats nasty right. He has his uses, but its usually build in some kind of synergy, not just pointing his "thing" and twin linking random guns. Take him out, and you break that synergy.

The second one is the Canoptec Spider.... to tell the truth, i like this guys, no idea why they don't see table, but it depedns on the taste of the person who playes them and on your local meta. The Spiders are a MONSTROUS CREATURE ! - that by itself makes them awesome. They have very nice statline and with 3 Wounds each, you get a good chance of causing some havoc. The usual 3+ save makes them nice and sturdy to a degree.
Now the reason why i think they are overlooked by many is due to their main ability - They can spawn more Scarab bases. And scarabs are awesome right ? Well they are quite limited at this. The unit spawned can even form a unit of its own, AND act normally (something the Tyranid Tervigons got nerfed seriously).
They have few possible upgrades: one that allows you to repair weapon destroyed or immobilized on one of your vehicles on a roll of D6. The second one, is a weird gimmicky thingy against psychic powers. No idea why would enemy psykers target your Spiders, but ah well can come in handy one day...
They have few upgrades but are not really that worth it.
In all honesty ? Monstrous Creatures in this edition are freakishly awesome, and these dudes cost only 50 points !! For S/T6 3W each monstrous creature. I would definitely run them in a unit of 3 just for the heck of it, and to force my opponent to shot them and waste his bullets.

The weird ones - The last in this post are the Destroyers and Tomb blades. The first named were awesome in the previous edition. Basically what you get is a tough necron guy, with good antitank weaponry. They get solid shoting and have the Preffered Enemy EVERYTHING ! special rule This should make them awesome, and they are.... the problem is, 1 Wound, and that really is not that hard to get on a 3+ model, with the current rulebooks coming out. They are priced fairly reasonably, though at the end of the day, due to the terrible Internal (in)balance of the Codex (again thanks Ward...) they don't see the table as often as they used to. No longer a mainstay.
There is also the Destroyer Lord - a character, this guy is VERY tough, can dish out pain in both CC and Shooting, and has the same awesome rule. The problem is, though high T, and good save, he has just 3 wounds, and is priced fairly high for a character which makes him a big commitment when it comes to down to the points. He can be great, but usually is overshadowed by the normal Necron Overlord.

Tomb Blades ... heh, odd ones these are indeed. Not a bad choice, and sure fun to play with and against. They are low costed jetbikes, and bikes are awesome (+1T). These guys are fast and have TL weaponry. They come with Tesla wepon and get a free swap for Gauss. Also they can get a nasty blast weapon. They have a couple of nice and usefull upgrades, but the best bet is to run them naked. Two units of 3-5 guys. Great unit.... agains overshadowed by the soo awesome Wraiths which are just plainly broken (not due to the rules but due the low cost, compared to what they can do) and Scarab swarms.
Not the top competative choice but still a good one, that gives the Necron player a good fast way to harass your back lines, and keep you distracted while the more scary things come in...
Also they get to reanimate, which might be situationaly good, if you can get these rolls.

The Flayed stuff - These guys are nuts... literally. Just go and take a look at the miniatures, you ll understand what i mean. Hehe, but with that aside. The Flayed one are basically yet another close combat unit for the Necron. So what to expect ? First off, they can form a unit of 20. Each one of them has 3 attacks, at S4. No AP but 3 attacks. Thats 4 on a charge, 80 attacks at WS4 S4 in total. No matter the AP this guys can dish out a paint, and lots of it as well. Soo why not seen soo often ? - Simple - expensive and weak save for a CC specialist unit. Especially against Tau, its hard to get the unit into close combat. There are ways to improve them, (like sticking a tanky character upfront with 2+ save, and orb of ressurection, to try and soak up those wounds and help those that fail on Look out Sir to come back) but still.
They can Infiltrate, which is quite nice, and if done correctly, the right terrain and a bit of luck they can pop 12" form your enemy in the first round. Other than that, they can Deep Strike. As i said, they are not bad, but with the redundancy of choices due to the sheer OPness on some other stuff you will rarely see them on the table.

So thats about it for my short review of the less frequent stuff. Its not super indepth, but should give you some insight into what the enemy can pull out against you.
**I have added Deathmarks into my previous post, and moved the flayed ones down here.

por'el vior'la Kais

Re: Necrons

Post#11 » May 07 2014 12:58

You guys are forgetting something. Their over lords in command barges. These things are crazy, my friend takes at least two and just zipps them up to me, even if I manage to take them down (imobilize won't work for some special rule reason) they will proceed to footslog to me, and believe me they are unkillable. Higher toughness then a marine, terminator save and stormshield invurn. + they will be back on a 4+ with D3 wounds for the first time, and they will kill anything in combat. Strangely enough the only unit that has succesfully worked against them were my commander and his buds, and even more strange is that they did so in combat. You will need to bring some long range anti tank to take out their barges fast. If that guy gets even close you have a big problem!

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Kael'yn
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Posts: 1062

Re: Necrons

Post#12 » May 07 2014 06:09

por'el vior'la Kais wrote:You guys are forgetting something. Their over lords in command barges. These things are crazy, my friend takes at least two and just zipps them up to me, even if I manage to take them down (imobilize won't work for some special rule reason) they will proceed to footslog to me, and believe me they are unkillable. Higher toughness then a marine, terminator save and stormshield invurn. + they will be back on a 4+ with D3 wounds for the first time, and they will kill anything in combat. Strangely enough the only unit that has succesfully worked against them were my commander and his buds, and even more strange is that they did so in combat. You will need to bring some long range anti tank to take out their barges fast. If that guy gets even close you have a big problem!


The first time I see them, I was annoyed too.
Then I realize some things:
- It cannot do a sweeping attack if it has no room to land : use terrains / 2''-spaced units to block him landing and prevent sweeping attacks on the important guys.
- two dual fusion blaster are dangerous for him at distance, but he can tank the shots with its invuln.
- best counter is : S10 AP1/2 with a railgun/onager/Riptide: either is let the S10 goes to the vehicle, with the risk to explode, either he took it, and can be ID, so without reanimation IIRC. And this kind of weapon has good use too against quantum/monolith so it is not wasted (take submunitions against warriors).

Also, after you take down the quantum, a massed S5 volley make him cry (have you ever tried to roll 20 5++ shots...). It has great chances to die and his vehicle to be HP stripped.

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CoffeeGrunt
Shas'Ui
Posts: 1122

Re: Necrons

Post#13 » May 07 2014 07:50

either is let the S10 goes to the vehicle, with the risk to explode, either he took it, and can be ID, so without reanimation IIRC. And this kind of weapon has good use too against quantum/monolith so it is not wasted (take submunitions against warriors).


He still reanimates if he was killed through Instant Death, just like all Necrons. Also, he can't take hits for the vehicle if he's embarked on it. Otherwise I could just kill a Fire Warrior for every Lascannon that would wreck my Devilfish.

por'el vior'la Kais

Re: Necrons

Post#14 » May 07 2014 09:01

yeah the trick is to take down the transport at range and then mass fire at him, his 2+ will only save him so much wounds, the biggest problem is killing him at a big enough distance, especially with that jinx save, since markerlights have limited range I can't snipe him easily from afar, and up close... well lets just say: too late.

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Kael'yn
Fio'Ui
Posts: 1062

Re: Necrons

Post#15 » May 07 2014 01:16

CoffeeGrunt wrote:
either is let the S10 goes to the vehicle, with the risk to explode, either he took it, and can be ID, so without reanimation IIRC. And this kind of weapon has good use too against quantum/monolith so it is not wasted (take submunitions against warriors).


He still reanimates if he was killed through Instant Death, just like all Necrons. Also, he can't take hits for the vehicle if he's embarked on it. Otherwise I could just kill a Fire Warrior for every Lascannon that would wreck my Devilfish.


I still have the old We'll Be Back rule in mind...

I misunderstood (not having the rule under the eyes) the wound offered to repare Immobilized/Weapon Destroyed, and not a wound for any hit taken by the ride (special rule for this necron vehicle only, too bad for the FW heroically saving his ride).

Also, the vehicle (and the character in) are not locked in melee, so you can shoot him even if people are doing close combat with.

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Myrdin
Shas
Posts: 403

Re: Necrons

Post#16 » Jun 05 2014 03:23

Since the new edition is out i would like to point out one significant thing.

With the vehicle chart moving and thus nerfing the various weapons that can actually penetrate it, necron vehicles are now much more powerful with the quantum shielding. This should be countered with melta weaponry en mass, so having a single dedicated unit of C. suits with fusion blasters is a good idea.

Also - the chariots received a rather powerful boost, being able to capitalize from the saving throws (lets say 3+ invul overlord) of the IC that rides it, AS well as - in the case of Necrons - reanimating togather with its owner.
Yup thats right, now if you destroy the chariot you the character as well, BUT if he reanimates the chariot comes back as well (thats due to the overall change of chariots, becoming one with its rider, no longer allowing any way of dismounting). So keep that in mind, when you see a necron Command Barge - it can come back if shot down.

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Kael'yn
Fio'Ui
Posts: 1062

Re: Necrons

Post#17 » Jun 05 2014 03:37

Myrdin wrote:With the vehicle chart moving and thus nerfing the various weapons that can actually penetrate it.


Could you elaborate ? Nerfing was only on penetrating effects, not penetrating chances (to disable Quantum).
Melta, HRR, seekers, Railhead, ... all of them disable QS like before.

Chariot is now effectively a vehicle with a character upgrade. I don't know how they behave now with this set of rule.

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boomwolf
Shas'La
Posts: 1752

Re: Necrons

Post#18 » Jun 05 2014 03:48

What he meant is that high-pen weapons (such as railguns) were based on the table to do "one-hit-kill" strikes, and now its less often, therefor they are indirecty nerfed.
Contradicting "glace" type weapons who feature many shots, but less 1-shot chance to begin with, and they never PLANNED to one-shot anything.

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