Ynnari rules discussion

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nic
Kroot'La
Posts: 603

Ynnari rules discussion

Post#1 » Feb 04 2017 09:25

With the Black Library preview available some of the rules for the new Ynnari faction are emerging.

This is a new 4th faction of Eldar (now generically the Aeldari) which has a new special rule. With only the glossary entries to go from I would hesitate to state with certainty what limits this might have but essentially the key rule here is Soulburst.

When a unit has a Soulburst it can immediately take an action; this can be a normal move, a shooting/run/turbo-boost action or it can immediately declare and resolve a charge. A given unit can only take one Soulburst action per turn - at first glance it appears that this would mean one in the Ynnari players turn and possibly one in the opposing turn.

The main trigger for a Soulburst would be an Aeldari unit being destroyed when within 7" of a non-vehicle Ynnari unit - which may then Soulburst. There do seem to be another couple of ways to do this with a relic weapon or a psychic power - and one formation that allows all the units within it to Soulburst together if any one of them qualifies to Soulburst.

[edit] On re-reading the Soulburst happens when any unit is destroyed within 7" of a non-vehicle Ynnari unit. The rule that grants this is Strength from Death which looks to be the new faction special rule, probably replacing Power from Pain or Battle Focus as appropriate. The individual power-ups of the new characters are what only happens on the death of Aeldari.

I can see some very powerful applications of that one rule alone if it stands as I see it now and MSU Eldar armies may just have become significantly nastier in any game without kill points. I thought it would be worth us having a discussion thread for this as further details emerge.

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SinisterSamurai
Kor'La
Posts: 351

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#2 » Feb 05 2017 01:06

There's not much that can be done to counter something like that. Units being destroyed is a natural result of gameplay, and is something that almost every faction aims to do. I've already seen some strategy proposals for forcing your Farseer to die from perils of the warp to trigger multiple soulbursts on turn 1. (This is inherently flawed, as only one unit benefits per destroyed unit).

While it will be important to know what units or formations gain Strength From Death, if it is indeed an army-wide special rule, there's only a few real tactical options at our disposal.

You can focus less on Multiple Small Units and begin investing in blobs again, to make your own units a bit tankier and give fewer opportunities for the opponent to gain Strength from Death.

You can spread your units out and try to keep your distance. If your unit is destroyed outside of the 7" bubble, the opponent doesn't gain a bonus.

An alternative is to attempt mass tarpitting. Units locked in combat, gone-to-ground, or falling back don't get a soulburst. If the new Eldar are by some miracle vulnerable to pinning, then maybe pulse carbines might see more use.

If you're losing an assault, you might volunteer to fail certain leadership checks to make your unit run away, rather than be destroyed utterly.

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Unusualsuspect
Kroot'Ui
Posts: 475

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#3 » Feb 05 2017 09:37

SinisterSamurai wrote:There's not much that can be done to counter something like that. Units being destroyed is a natural result of gameplay, and is something that almost every faction aims to do. I've already seen some strategy proposals for forcing your Farseer to die from perils of the warp to trigger multiple soulbursts on turn 1. (This is inherently flawed, as only one unit benefits per destroyed unit).


While that is true generally, IIRC there was at least one formation/special rule that allowed for multiple units to benefit from the same destroyed unit trigger.

In terms of addressing the rules, I feel there's simply too little that's actually known about the composition of enemy forces. The extent to which being within 7" of the Ynnari is avoidable is going to depend heavily on what forces the formations granting Strength From Death ("SFD") allow the Ynnari to take.

Overall and taken at face value, SFD seems to be significantly more versatile than existing Eldar army-wide special rules (which most seem to think get replaced by SFD), but at the cost of unreliability and rarity. At its best, it could mean nearly doubling the Ynnari's firepower, which could be a very daunting prospect.

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Jefffar
Shas'Vre
Posts: 946

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#4 » Feb 05 2017 09:49

My concern, if I read this right, is that it may allow a unit to win combat, destroy the opposing unit, then immediately charge another unit.

Please let me know if I am missing something in the way this rule works.

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SomeTauGuy
Shas'Ui
Posts: 64

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#5 » Feb 05 2017 10:42

Jefffar wrote:My concern, if I read this right, is that it may allow a unit to win combat, destroy the opposing unit, then immediately charge another unit.

Please let me know if I am missing something in the way this rule works.


Yup, thats right. The Soulburst rule shown on bols (and I'm going to assume that it's accurate, we'll know for sure on the weekend) tells you how to resolve it though. If a Soulburst unit destroys the unit its in CC with, at the end of that initiative step it can make a charge move as if it was your Charge Sub-phase into another enemy unit and then you continue to resolve the Initiative steps as before ie: you continue from whatever the next lowest initiative step is.

The thing is, its quite likely that the SoulBursting unit has already had most/all of its attacks at its much higher, World War Z, zombie space elf initiative. So they probably won't dish out many/any attacks from the Soulbursting unit and its likely (as most other armies have lower initiative) that the other unit will get to swing back at them.

And they won't count as charging in the next turn so won't get any bonus attacks for doing it. It would be situational but I'd expect the Aeldari player to only do this if they wanted to avoid getting charged by that unit in their opponents next turn.

Whats more likely is they'll use the Soulburst-shooting ability straight after winning CC...

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Unusualsuspect
Kroot'Ui
Posts: 475

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#6 » Feb 05 2017 11:07

And they won't count as charging in the next turn so won't get any bonus attacks for doing it. It would be situational but I'd expect the Aeldari player to only do this if they wanted to avoid getting charged by that unit in their opponents next turn.


Not only avoid getting charged, but to tie up a shooting unit and/or prevent that Ynnari unit from being destroyed during the enemy player's phase. This seems particularly relevant to Tau players such as ourselves, what with our notoriously weak CC capabilities and our similarly notoriously powerful shooting phase.

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Vector Strike
Shas'La
Posts: 618

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#7 » Feb 06 2017 08:11

Out-of-turn activations? Ugh. Interceptor already makes games longer - that one will make them even more...

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nic
Kroot'La
Posts: 603

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#8 » Feb 06 2017 08:53

Jefffar wrote:My concern, if I read this right, is that it may allow a unit to win combat, destroy the opposing unit, then immediately charge another unit.

Please let me know if I am missing something in the way this rule works.


From what we can see that is exactly how it would work. That would make my kroot bubble-wrap far less effective unless I space them a lot further away from my high value units.

Looking at the formation bundles it appears that at least some of the best eldar units - jetbikes, wraithguard for example - will be available in the new faction. Shooting one unit of jet bikes only for another to get an out of sequence action will make them even trickier opponents than they already are.

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Panzer
Shas'La
Posts: 967

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#9 » Feb 06 2017 12:15

Vector Strike wrote:Out-of-turn activations? Ugh. Interceptor already makes games longer - that one will make them even more...

Not if you wipe the unit out that you intercept. :P

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SinisterSamurai
Kor'La
Posts: 351

Re: Ynnari rules discussion

Post#10 » Feb 06 2017 01:27

But now wiping out that unit might proc another out-of-sequence event.

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