Upcoming T'au Codex

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Ricordis
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 340

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#37 » Jul 08 2017 07:29

Wow, you think pretty radical on Sept bonuses.
You might tune that down. A direct buff to the statlines is pretty hard, no matter which one it would be.

It might be something more like:
"Sa'cea, specialized in Infantry, Ghost Warfare, and Broadside maneuvers, are highly disciplined and absolutely obedient to Ethereals. They use Crisis suits barely."
Battlesuits come with a Targetlock pre installed additionally to a free system slot. Sa'cea may not take XV8 or XV104 battlesuits and their sub-models except for XV85 Enforcer and XV86 Coldstar.

Something like this. I have to admit I just thought that up quickly but it's about the general idea:
Give some kind of situational/niché buff which fits the fluff but only with a drawback.
(Yeah, I am one of the few who liked formations. Get bonuses but you have to accept the drawbacks)

Would the following fit for Vior'la?
Units from the Vior'la Sept gain an additional attack and hit against enemies closer than 6".

This could be a huge buff to some statlines but to utilize this you have to play "aggressively and hot-blooded"

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Shas'O Bentu'nan
Shas'Saal
Posts: 54

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#38 » Jul 08 2017 10:21

Ricordis wrote:Wow, you think pretty radical on Sept bonuses.
You might tune that down. A direct buff to the statlines is pretty hard, no matter which one it would be.

It might be something more like:
"Sa'cea, specialized in Infantry, Ghost Warfare, and Broadside maneuvers, are highly disciplined and absolutely obedient to Ethereals. They use Crisis suits barely."
Battlesuits come with a Targetlock pre installed additionally to a free system slot. Sa'cea may not take XV8 or XV104 battlesuits and their sub-models except for XV85 Enforcer and XV86 Coldstar.

Something like this. I have to admit I just thought that up quickly but it's about the general idea:
Give some kind of situational/niché buff which fits the fluff but only with a drawback.
(Yeah, I am one of the few who liked formations. Get bonuses but you have to accept the drawbacks)

Would the following fit for Vior'la?
Units from the Vior'la Sept gain an additional attack and hit against enemies closer than 6".

This could be a huge buff to some statlines but to utilize this you have to play "aggressively and hot-blooded"


I was thinking along the exact same lines. A minor army building tweek and maybe a strategem or two. A decent sept feature may be something like stealth suits can also fill a troop slot for purposes of battleforging armies. Bonuses like this have a big change to the theme and composition of the army without some of the harder stat changes. Such big buffs have a problem that if you mathhammer there will likely be one that is OBJECTIVELY superior and all tau players feel they MUST play that sept or be weaker.

TL;DR version:

Army building bonuses lead to diveraity.
diversity is good.
Stat bonuses or widescale buffs decrease diversity.
Decreased diversity is bad.
Commander wiseblade

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Shas'Bro
Shas'Saal
Posts: 57

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#39 » Jul 08 2017 04:27

Ricordis wrote:Wow, you think pretty radical on Sept bonuses.
You might tune that down. A direct buff to the statlines is pretty hard, no matter which one it would be.

It might be something more like:
"Sa'cea, specialized in Infantry, Ghost Warfare, and Broadside maneuvers, are highly disciplined and absolutely obedient to Ethereals. They use Crisis suits barely."
Battlesuits come with a Targetlock pre installed additionally to a free system slot. Sa'cea may not take XV8 or XV104 battlesuits and their sub-models except for XV85 Enforcer and XV86 Coldstar.

Something like this. I have to admit I just thought that up quickly but it's about the general idea:
Give some kind of situational/niché buff which fits the fluff but only with a drawback.
(Yeah, I am one of the few who liked formations. Get bonuses but you have to accept the drawbacks)

Would the following fit for Vior'la?
Units from the Vior'la Sept gain an additional attack and hit against enemies closer than 6".

This could be a huge buff to some statlines but to utilize this you have to play "aggressively and hot-blooded"


Lol really? In all honesty they shouldn't meddle with sept bonuses if the past is anything to judge by...hence why I joked about the statline traits. GW has proven itself incompetent in handling anything remotely resembling differentiation, it quickly becomes "X is much superior to Y, Z, A, and B." Suddenly everyone starts painting their models X.

FW has been very good on the other hand doing such a thing (Heresy, krieg, Elysians). If you want to limit such a thing in your Sa'cea example, why not just do it yourself? Limit your own models and upgrades. Don't add free things for taking a sept...everyone should have learned that the hard way from formations. If anything, just have different FOC detachments to reflect the different nature. Otherwise we will get Riptidewing edition 2.0.
*As your Rules Laywer, I advise you against that action

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Overheal
Shas'Saal
Posts: 177

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#40 » Jul 08 2017 05:45

I'm not expecting a resculpt of anything with the new release. T'au have seen so much love in the last couple years already, all of our battlesuits are brand new or refreshed up to a couple years. Hammerheads are still fine, as are flyers etc. it would really be the kroot and for reasons I may have explained earlier I think that unless it's a full carnivore squad with plastic hounds, and either a krootox on the spruce or 3 as a kit, I can't imagine what else the army would possibly need right now. ?

Tell you what though, after reading IA Xenia it strikes me hard that Necrons are owed a Titan of some sort.

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Vio'ra Mal'caor
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 234

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#41 » Jul 08 2017 07:57

vehicle upgrades, new units, rules for Technical Drones, Less redundancy in 8th rules, removal of whatever the hell Power Level is, addition of Shas'o Kais as a commander, better rules for drones, battlesuit signiture systems, better save for Crisis suits, less use of d3 and d6 for wounds and return of single wound system, better rules for pulse rifle/carbine/pistol, return of all our kickass gear in full glory, removal of manta rules- not everyone can afford a gorram manta GW-, and new weapons and wargear for the new edition.

On a side note, I would also like to see some new IA and rules for FW models in 8th. Alsoe like to see a updated Manta army, as they are still using the original casts. Also like to see someone temper Matt Wanker's obsession with Ultramarines, and remove the frakking imperial Hover Tank that some genius (cough cough, C.S. Goto/Minuscule Weiner, sorry Matt Ward) and also the removal of Rowboat Girlyman. I mean, serously: what were they thinking when they bought back that abomination of a writer.
Igne vir renovatur integra

Jacket
Shas'Saal
Posts: 381

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#42 » Jul 08 2017 08:33

Overheal wrote:I'm not expecting a resculpt of anything with the new release. T'au have seen so much love in the last couple years already, all of our battlesuits are brand new or refreshed up to a couple years. Hammerheads are still fine, as are flyers etc. it would really be the kroot and for reasons I may have explained earlier I think that unless it's a full carnivore squad with plastic hounds, and either a krootox on the spruce or 3 as a kit, I can't imagine what else the army would possibly need right now. ?

Tell you what though, after reading IA Xenia it strikes me hard that Necrons are owed a Titan of some sort.

We don't need 40k. We don't "need" pillows or coffee or cars to live. All we need is food, water, and reproduction. Variety is the spice of life. I always get mad when people say we don't need anything. It sounds like lunacy. We exist... time to climb back into the trees we baked everything possible time to give up on cooking. Who needs fried food or steamed food or all the other variety out there.

Insane sounding. That aside.

We theoretically need a good re-balancing to bring us up to mid tier, but that is boring. I want to see new models.

Tau transforming battle suit. Comes with the vehicle model and battlesuit model. Now that is some stylish and classic visual variety added to the army and it would allow for more versatile units.

XV 22 stealth suits or amass produced version.

Generic stealth suit commander kind of like how we have a generic crisis commander.

Mass Effect Biotic/Tech power Psychic powers for Tau or if tat triggers the fundamentalists too much then an auxiliary who does it.

New super heavy tank. Despite being a super tank this would represent some of the greatest technological advancements of all the Tau lines being put into one unit. Despite it's small size it packs a mean technological superiority. I can see it being slightly bigger than our current tank but being a much meaner vehicle. This would be a real great surprise visually when one of our toughest units is in this small package. This would take visual ques from the real life T-14 Armata 5th generation stealth tank. Where as the current Tau tanks look like modern day 4th gen tanks the next generation of tank is around the corner. A higher emphasis on stealth, ecm, and decoys. It has an ability like the ghostkeel to reduce incoming fire against it. It has a single turret but it's a twin-linked coil gun so essentially two shots. On top it would have a mounted twin burst cannon or small weapon of choice. Front mounted hull weapon of some sort and finally it's coilgun can fire three different shots. Anti-tank, canister, or missile rounds. Has several smoke launchers as well as reactive armour. It's main turret can be swapped out in the field for various mission packages so it can have different main weapons packages.

Helicopter Gunship inspired flyer. Makes two models. The combat one and one with transport capacity. Tau version of the Corvus Blackstar.

Vanguard Void Suits (the ones from the FFG thing). Big bulky dudes who's armour can't fly in atmosphere. This is the equivalent of Tau terminator armour and would synergies well with the above hover transport and other transport methods.

Next generation XV8. Like the XV8 is the current generation of its class I want to see the next generation of battlesuits and the successor platform. It would start with the next gen crisis equivalent.

New Tau drones. Not the little disc guys but a beefier chassis that is more like a drone tank that real armies use now but taken up to 40k coolness and scale.

A new Tau weapon or two that can be put on anything (eventually once enough are made). I think the rail gun right now is great but I want to see a rapid fire version of it that sacrifices some power (but has some devent ap). Finally a more elite choice would be the next generation of rail weapon from a science fiction point. The coil gun which is a bigger, badder, and meaner railrifle.

Kroot Hunters who use technology fully and are basically a predator ripoff (the movies) but look like beefier kroots who want to return to their glorious hunting past. They would use Tau cloaking for example and have a few units including the elder huntskroot. Weapons style would be things like high tech spears, glaives, toxin dart launchers, light but higher tech armour than their primitive kin, wrist blades, and shoulder mounted plasma blasters or other weapons of choice. The higher rank they are the more relics they can use from other factions. Highly elite and highly customizable release.

Vespid drones. Cheap cheap swarm army. Given cheap neutron guns and pointed at the enemy. Their speciality is to swarm them in melee and when there is large numbers of them they latch onto targets and vibrate causing the enemies to overheat and die. Yes if they heat themselves up enough too long they die, but they are expendable to the queens.

Royal Guards. Big beefy guys with more arms and a huge melee focus. They can fly and fight in melee rather well, but due to their innate instincts have lost a lot of skill with their ranged weapons. They have gained a potent poison sting.

A non lazy Gue'vesa release. I want to see the Gue'vesa get a battlesuit release. Their elite option would be the older version of the XV series updated and retrofitted with modern weaponry. This way the Tau can make use of older stores of weapons, but they aren't giving too valuable stuff out. Perhaps the trusted Gue'vesa officers can have a human tailored XV8. These suits would be melee specialists. A few other models to round out the release.

Demiurg could be their whole own faction, but my creativity juices are trying up right now. So this is it for now.

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Arka0415
Shas'Ui
Shas'Ui
Posts: 2201

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#43 » Jul 08 2017 09:36

Vio'ra Mal'caor wrote:vehicle upgrades, new units, rules for Technical Drones, Less redundancy in 8th rules, removal of whatever the hell Power Level is, addition of Shas'o Kais as a commander, better rules for drones, battlesuit signiture systems, better save for Crisis suits, less use of d3 and d6 for wounds and return of single wound system, better rules for pulse rifle/carbine/pistol, return of all our kickass gear in full glory, removal of manta rules- not everyone can afford a gorram manta GW-, and new weapons and wargear for the new edition.

On a side note, I would also like to see some new IA and rules for FW models in 8th. Alsoe like to see a updated Manta army, as they are still using the original casts. Also like to see someone temper Matt Wanker's obsession with Ultramarines, and remove the frakking imperial Hover Tank that some genius (cough cough, C.S. Goto/Minuscule Weiner, sorry Matt Ward) and also the removal of Rowboat Girlyman. I mean, serously: what were they thinking when they bought back that abomination of a writer.


This isn't a wishlisting thread, and you know 100% that those things aren't happening.

Rather, let's talk about what we know is going to happen. Sept perks. Relics and signature systems. New lore. Possibly a new, small model release.

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Bloodknife92
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 594

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#44 » Jul 09 2017 03:11

While against the Member guidelines and expectations to be wishlisting, and I will admit, most of the wishlisting on here is rather obsurd like asking for an extra hard point on Crisis suits or changing the Markerlight system. I'm not going to wishlist, but if GW added some benefits beyond 5 Markerlight hits then I'd certainly be a bit happier about my 10 strong Pathfinder units.

I for one am extremely excited as it is very very clear how the players feel about the current T'au in the index, and that gives GW a set of clear directions to go in when formulating our new codex. I'm enjoying using the new index, but I think that's just the enjoyment of change coming out. I've lost all 3 games I've played, but still enjoyed them. I'm adamant we can be sure of at least two additions. The return of signature systems and vehicle upgrades. We wouldn't be the T'au without both of those important things.
The days of goodly English is went
Ziss old dog still has a few tricks!

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Kakapo42
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 950

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#45 » Jul 09 2017 03:29

I applaud the recent efforts by members to steer this topic away from wishlisting. Please remember that wishlisting is against ATT forum rules, and that you have been warned about this already.
A Shas and a Kor walk into a bar...
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Finghain
Shas'Saal
Posts: 9

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#46 » Jul 09 2017 07:05

After GW clarified that they will "update" units with new points cost/possibly different wargear options and those changes will overwrite the corresponding Index entry, and with the mix of "main" codexes (sm, csm) and subfactions, one thing they could to would be to release a codex: farsight enclaves first to give a rework to (crisis) suits, MLs and general wargear without any new kit releases and then do a T'au Empire codex next year which overhauls the rest. Depending on if they thing the suits are working as intended right now.

Purely speculative, of course; hope, it's not too wishlist-y ;)

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Lechai Skull
Shas'Saal
Posts: 365

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#47 » Jul 09 2017 07:48

they would never ever release a farsight enclave book before the core Tau Codex

Core comes first

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Jefffar
Shas'Vre
Shas'Vre
Posts: 1020

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#48 » Jul 09 2017 08:25

Farsighted Enclaves isn't Space Wolves to the Tau Empire's Ultramarines. its more like the White Scars.

For there to be a proper codex for Farsight (not a codex suppliment like we had before) there would need to be new units and new models, neither of which I are coming soon.

Instead we will see some notes for Sept Farsight Enclaves saying something like Farsight Enclaves detachments may include Crisis Suits as troops but cant include Ethereals and probably a bonus to morale or.close combat.

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thezanji
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 69

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#49 » Jul 09 2017 08:46

Hi guys, just wanted to mention that probably our anti-psyker ability will come in the form of the thalisman of arthas moloch.

Looking at age of sigmar for example, i own two armies with no wizards, khorn and stormcasts, and both have antimagic abilities that are objects, a lantern or a demon's collar. So im sure the thalisman will have a very similar text to this:

The bearer of the thalisman of arthas moloch can deny the witch in the same manner as a psyker once in each enemy psychic phase.

I know some people disliked the new sept mechanics but they came to stay, so lets hope they bring nice rules instead of just being limitations.

I'm looking forward to see what will the other sygnature systems do now, sice the dawn blade got way better, i supose the fusion blades will improve too. But all the others keep my curiosity alive; warscaper drone, sismic thingy, onager gauntlet, retro thrusters?

A specific stratagem like "add a markerlight to a unit you chose" seems very tauish and it would strigly motivate us to take battallion or even brigade.

Cheers!

Ricordis
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 340

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#50 » Jul 09 2017 09:05

While GW said the Indices wouldn't invalidate any models I am a little bit afraid the Codices will.
Many things in the T'au part of Xenos II look half baked and thus just like a step stone for our 7th edition model range to a final 8th edition.
The loss of most systems for suits and vehicles, free promotions, only pistols for Shas'uis;
These are, for me at least, only placeholders for some bigger changes.

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QimRas
Shas'Saal
Posts: 315

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#51 » Jul 09 2017 09:17

Ricordis wrote:While GW said the Indices wouldn't invalidate any models I am a little bit afraid the Codices will.
Many things in the T'au part of Xenos II look half baked and thus just like a step stone for our 7th edition model range to a final 8th edition.
The loss of most systems for suits and vehicles, free promotions, only pistols for Shas'uis;
These are, for me at least, only placeholders for some bigger changes.


In the FAQ for the codecies, they did mention that not all models would get Codex rules. For those models the Index rules will continue to apply and be valid.

Ricordis
Shas'La
Shas'La
Posts: 340

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#52 » Jul 09 2017 09:33

While Codex-models get fresh rules, calibrated point costs and even some fancy rules Index-models stay the same (rubbish).
This is some kind of soft-invalidating.

(That's my own opinion. I also don't like FW and WD rules. There's a reason they aren't in rulebooks.)

DancinHobo
Shas
Posts: 88

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#53 » Jul 09 2017 10:44

Ricordis wrote:While Codex-models get fresh rules, calibrated point costs and even some fancy rules Index-models stay the same (rubbish).
This is some kind of soft-invalidating.

(That's my own opinion. I also don't like FW and WD rules. There's a reason they aren't in rulebooks.)


I thought I read that it was characters that might not be getting rules. I assume with the time jump, characters for all factions will be kicking it. So why give newer rules to the dead characters. We will probably see new characters and heros to replace the old.

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Unusualsuspect
Kroot'Ui
Kroot'Ui
Posts: 597

Re: Upcoming T'au Codex

Post#54 » Jul 09 2017 12:24

DancinHobo wrote:
Ricordis wrote:While Codex-models get fresh rules, calibrated point costs and even some fancy rules Index-models stay the same (rubbish).
This is some kind of soft-invalidating.

(That's my own opinion. I also don't like FW and WD rules. There's a reason they aren't in rulebooks.)


I thought I read that it was characters that might not be getting rules. I assume with the time jump, characters for all factions will be kicking it. So why give newer rules to the dead characters. We will probably see new characters and heros to replace the old.


The only characters I can think of that wouldn't have a plausible explanation for why they're still alive would be T'au, and I only say the explanation isn't plausible because everything suggests that the T'au have been actively fighting in warzones a lot of this time, so putting your best commanders to sleep for the duration doesn't really ring as "likely" to me.

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