Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Discuss both Auxiliary, Allied and Aliens tactics
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Vector Strike
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Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#1 » Jul 14 2017 07:01

Let's discuss the impact of this chapter tactics when playing against ultras.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/201 ... ge-post-2/

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Basically, EVERY unit with Chapter Tactics has Fly at -1BS. I think this is quite strong, as one of our tactics is to charge units with our Fly ones to avoid them firing back at us. As Dreads are specifically called for having it, I guess at least them and all infantry will have it too.
Conversely, we have Darkstrider to simulate that with our infantry (not suits, mind you) at 6" of him, while Ultras got a passive effect.

It impacts melee armies more than us, but still... wow! :eek:

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Arka0415
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#2 » Jul 14 2017 07:22

Vector Strike wrote:Basically, EVERY unit with Chapter Tactics has Fly at -1BS. I think this is quite strong, as one of our tactics is to charge units with our Fly ones to avoid them firing back at us. As Dreads are specifically called for having it, I guess at least them and all infantry will have it too.
Conversely, we have Darkstrider to simulate that with our infantry (not suits, mind you) at 6" of him, while Ultras got a passive effect.

It impacts melee armies more than us, but still... wow! :eek:


This definitely a solid, fair rule. Ultramarines are all about bravery and tactical flexibility, and this fits them perfectly I think. Good options, but at a small cost. Let's hope Tau get something so well-designed when our own Codex comes out!

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Lechai Skull
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#3 » Jul 14 2017 07:27

and the smurf love from GW continues...

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Panzer
Shas'La
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#4 » Jul 14 2017 07:31

Now now, Fly does a lot more than just falling back and still being able to shoot.
I'm quite pleased with this Chapter Tactic. Makes ultramarines play very differently from the other Marines (most likely) but isn't broken or anything like that.
I admit I kinda expected them to have more CP or being able to use a stratagem twice per phase or something like that. This sounds more fun to play though. :D

Also: "like all Chapter Tactics, this will apply to your Infantry, Bikers and Dreadnoughts. "

Also also: "The Ultramarines are also getting a unique stratagem, warlord trait and relic to allow you to further customise your army."
Sounds like they are only getting one each. o_O

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Vector Strike
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#5 » Jul 14 2017 07:46

Panzer wrote:Now now, Fly does a lot more than just falling back and still being able to shoot.


Yes, but for shooty infantry units (like most stuff Marines have), being able to leave combat and fire is good enough (and Marines have good flying transports, so no need to pass over terrain/models).
Previously, only units with some kind of tech letting them fly (assault marines, crisis, etc) or special characters let people leave combat and fire again. This CT makes an entire army (excluding normal vehicles) to do that!

I foresee a lot of blue marine models in mele-heavy metas

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Lechai Skull
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#6 » Jul 14 2017 08:12

Its just another Tau specific trait that's been handed out to others free of charge.

We almost have nothing faction specific left that hasn't had its heart and soul torn out and fed to others.

I'm sorry if this sounds pessimistic, but try and think of 1 specific aspect of the Tau that another faction cant do better.
i cant think of anything. And that's what i hate.

Melee - everyone
Psychic - everyone
shooting - admec and AM are better
buffs - necron, admec, SM all have better buffs than crappy markerlights.
durability - necrons, maybe space marines, hard to say as its so list specific.
reserves - maybe, suits and commanders with beacons are good, but assassins and genestealer cults have it good too
movement - definitely not us, all our big suits have heavy weapons and our buffs make us need to be stationary.
flyers - SM flyers are all cheaper and better than ours

We cant JSJ anymore, markerlights are dead, smurfs can all fall back and shoot just as good as us now, plasmas are gone, dangerous infantry now a joke, scary suits don't scare anymore, 1 shotting enemy heavy tanks is gone, we don't get snipers, drones protecting suits is almost gone.

I think we have officially had everything taken away from us that made us unique.

Why do they hate Tau so much?

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Arka0415
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#7 » Jul 14 2017 08:22

Lechai Skull wrote:We almost have nothing faction specific left that hasn't had its heart and soul torn out and fed to others.


Wait what? Loads of armies have the Fly keyword. Eldar, Space Marines, Necrons, Ministorum, and Dark Eldar have Fly units too.

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Panzer
Shas'La
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#8 » Jul 14 2017 08:22

Lechai Skull wrote:Its just another Tau specific trait that's been handed out to others free of charge.

We almost have nothing faction specific left that hasn't had its heart and soul torn out and fed to others.

I'm sorry if this sounds pessimistic, but try think of 1 specific aspect of our faction that another faction cant do better.
i cant think of anything. And that's what i hate.

Melee - everyone
Psychic - everyone
shooting - admec and AM are better
buffs - necron, admec, SM all have better buffs than crappy markerlights.
durability - necrons, maybe space marines, hard to say as its so list specific.
reserves - maybe, suits and commanders with beacons are good, but assassins and genestealer cults have it good too
movement - definitely not us, all our big suits have heavy weapons and our buffs make us need to be stationary.
flyers - SM flyers are all cheaper and better than ours

It's not though. Having Fly on a ton of our units is kinda a T'au specific trait (but that as well not really considering how many Jump Packs Blood Angels etc. can have). Fly itself is not T'au specific. We also have a good amount of units without Fly. Also Ultramarines get a worse version of Fly. The sky is not falling.

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Lechai Skull
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#9 » Jul 14 2017 08:24

Arka0415 wrote:
Lechai Skull wrote:We almost have nothing faction specific left that hasn't had its heart and soul torn out and fed to others.


Wait what? Loads of armies have the Fly keyword. Eldar, Space Marines, Necrons, Ministorum, and Dark Eldar have Fly units too.


name a single faction that has more % units with the fly keyword.
apart from our troops, everything has it!

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Lechai Skull
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#10 » Jul 14 2017 08:25

Panzer wrote: Also Ultramarines get a worse version of Fly. The sky is not falling.


last time i checked 3 + 1 = 4

they are EXACTLY the same as us dropping back out of combat.

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Panzer
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#11 » Jul 14 2017 08:27

Lechai Skull wrote:
Panzer wrote: Also Ultramarines get a worse version of Fly. The sky is not falling.


last time i checked 3 + 1 = 4

they are EXACTLY the same as us dropping back out of combat.

Last time I checked Ultramarine Tactics don't let you move over terrain and other models, charge airbourne units etc. etc.
You're very narrow minded because you simply want to cry about how bad T'au are and it frankly becomes annoying. There, I said it. Sorry Mods.

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Arka0415
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#12 » Jul 14 2017 08:29

Lechai Skull wrote:name a single faction that has more % units with the fly keyword.
apart from our troops, everything has it!


True, we have the most Fly out of all the factions. Now Ultramarines get a weaker version of the hit-and-run part of Fly on their Infantry, bikers, and Dreadnoughts. I'm not sure about you, but I was planning on charging their tanks, not their infantry or Dreadnoughts. It doesn't look like the tanks get Chapter Tactics, so that's still a major hole in the ability.

Lechai Skull wrote:last time i checked 3 + 1 = 4

they are EXACTLY the same as us dropping back out of combat.


We're less accurate base though. We don't drop to 5+ when we fall back. If we did that would be pretty awful. Marines get their Bolters firing at BS4+, their Lascannons firing at BS5+. We rely on strength over accuracy. They rely on accuracy over strength. We get the better end of the deal here.

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Panzer
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#13 » Jul 14 2017 08:29

Lechai Skull wrote:
Arka0415 wrote:
Lechai Skull wrote:We almost have nothing faction specific left that hasn't had its heart and soul torn out and fed to others.


Wait what? Loads of armies have the Fly keyword. Eldar, Space Marines, Necrons, Ministorum, and Dark Eldar have Fly units too.


name a single faction that has more % units with the fly keyword.
apart from our troops, everything has it!

Blood Angels have it on basically everything except for their Troops, Vehicle and Bikes. Oh and Dreadnoughts I guess. Their Vanguards, former Command Squad, All HQs, Assault Marines, Sanguinary Guard and Deathcompany all have (or can have) the Fly keyword as well.

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Lechai Skull
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#14 » Jul 14 2017 08:40

Panzer wrote:You're very narrow minded because you simply want to cry about how bad T'au are and it frankly becomes annoying. There, I said it. Sorry Mods.


really?
You think i'm narrow minded because i think Tau are weak. Obviously you never actually read ANYTHING i said. I never once complained about us being weak (weather we are or not).

I said we've lost everything that made us 'unique'.
(well game play wise, fluff wise were still Tau).

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Panzer
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#15 » Jul 14 2017 08:41

Lechai Skull wrote:
Panzer wrote:You're very narrow minded because you simply want to cry about how bad T'au are and it frankly becomes annoying. There, I said it. Sorry Mods.


really?
You think i'm narrow minded because i think Tau are weak. Obviously you never actually read ANYTHING i said. I never once complained about us being weak (weather we are or not).

I said we've lost everything that made us 'unique'.
(well game play wise, fluff wise were still Tau).

No I don't think you are narrow minded because you say T'au are weak. I think you are narrow minded because how you say it and for the reasons you say it.

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Lechai Skull
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Posts: 365

Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#16 » Jul 14 2017 08:46

Panzer wrote:You're very narrow minded because you simply want to cry about how bad T'au are


Panzer wrote:No I don't think you are narrow minded because you say T'au are weak.


I'm just gonna leave this here and walk away.
I'm done.

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Panzer
Shas'La
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#17 » Jul 14 2017 08:46

Goodbye.

Can't blame me for being annoyed at people for crying all the time that "GW hates T'au" "GW takes everything unique from T'au" and whatever. It's just as annoying as the never ending "Ultramarines get everything" and "Chaos doesn't get anything". Seriously.

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Glarblar
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Re: Ultramarines Chapter Tactics spotted!

Post#18 » Jul 14 2017 09:00

Vector Strike wrote:Let's discuss the impact of this chapter tactics when playing against ultras.


I'm not sure how many people were relying on Morale to take out squads but it looks like we will need more focus fire.

I don't think it affects us as much for our assault suit (flamers), as we should be taking Plasma versus marines anyways.

It probably affects glass cannon melee armies a lot more as our way of dealing with Ultras was through ranged combat.

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